Tell us what you think of the topics In Concept [Archive]

Julian's Touch

03-05-2004, 08:19 PM

Content Revisions : Good choice on revision.

Better Weapons : Maybe melee will be able to kill high level monster without waiting 10 minutes hitting it :) The mage's damage curve is too fast, you arrive quickly to one shot or 600 damage (with vuln) whereas melee, and archer, stick with low damage curve, too low. I am looking forward to it!

New Loot Armor : Make Scenario works on them! i like his style. But i wanna add my 2 pyreals :) you should add new style instead of reworking the art of armor. why not allow the old style of leather ? i mean it's still +1 style of different armor. Always more is better.

Rares : Thumb up !! Best loot system was Diablo. AC is still far cause weapon and armor have buff you can cast on you, except minor/major. Rares sounds like approaching Diablo's loot, so i am ok for it.
Btw, it means you can now add big event quest, with like 2000 special monsters, and the server counts each death so when you killed the 2k monster it trigger the end of the raid ?!! tell me yes it can :D

Further Buffing Improvements : Buffing improvement are always good to take!

Missile Attack Improvements : What about melee ? Can you add more use at the "high" "mid" "low" attack ? i know it varies a little on attack and def modifier, but it's kinda useless, as the power bar (except UA). If you want piercing, you make full speed, if not, make full power. I would like to know how many players melee are using other level than full speed/full melee. A pool could be very very meaning, also a pool asking : you using only "attack low" or you using the whole 3

Town Improvements : I liked the idea posted : a stam pool and mana pool to help buffing could attrack people to come buff, and then sell their stuff before they go back hunting. An idea i wanted to propose : Why not adding USELESS NPC ??? just women, child and people walking around doing nothing, just to make the town living?

Allegiance Improvements : Don't forget to add stuff for the monarch, cause with the xp change (i am not monarch) they are kinda out of the business. Xp was the only things they get from their vassals, rank comes from mules. There is no real point to be monarch except organize monarchy, quests, meetings, help people when you have something else planned, defend a followers who did a mistake or a grief... only bad side.

Mansion Improvements : With the /house recall monarch's villa, yes Mansion are useless.

PvP Changes : I am not on Darktide, but "things to fight over" are really needed. And sorry but on white servers, those PK arenas are waste and useless, and mostly meaningless :p

Web Integration : Mmmm no opinion. I don't really see the interest, and it could create more 'hacking problem'

Those letter are WAY TO GO !!
Best communication worker ever, Ibn :cool:

Avaton

03-05-2004, 08:22 PM

After playing another MMORPG that tied game login to web login for several months and watching how many players got "hacked" due to being tricked by bogus redirectors that looked exactly like the game's web forums login page, I'd have to say no thanks to allowing our game accounts to be tied to our web accounts. It wouldn't make me very upset to learn someone had "hacked" my web forum login information but if that information was also my game login information I would be incredibly upset.

Other than that I'm as happy as a clam in sand!

My two pyreals...

MIdnightFire7

03-05-2004, 08:24 PM

this is very interesting, but i do not like removing the Settlement Portals. it takes way way way to long to run around in dreth. making a simple quest like skill spec. take several hours. Not all of us have alot of time to play and these portals make quests we want to do not take so long.

Avaton

03-05-2004, 08:26 PM

Originally posted by MIdnightFire7
this is very interesting, but i do not like removing the Settlement Portals. it takes way way way to long to run around in dreth. making a simple quest like skill spec. take several hours. Not all of us have alot of time to play and these portals make quests we want to do not take so long.

As was stated they will be providing gems that will allow you to get to the settlements with no running at all. This is better not worse! :D

Deathspawner

03-05-2004, 08:27 PM

I can't wait to see the Rares/Better Weapons/Armor in the future.. sounds very interesting.

Thank god for the house purchase timer as well.. wise choice! Keep up the great work.

Zeds

03-05-2004, 08:33 PM

removing the settlement portals is bad in my opinion

they do not stop people from exploration , they didnt stop me from it . that is a bogus reason

Setolc

03-05-2004, 08:42 PM

Wow...That was a very long read, thank you for sharing Turbine's plans and visions.

I am very happy to see on the list mansion improvements.

Oizo_DT

03-05-2004, 08:52 PM

i love the mansion/villa barrier idea... but id like to add my 2 cents

there outta be a machine or somthing simular to somthing you have to inflict damage on and kill to make the barriers go down, therfor making followers defend it

it should be for monarchs only with a certain ammount of followers though to keep peoples regular mules safe

Paco_Taco_TD

03-05-2004, 09:35 PM

Content Revisions
In the future, we would like to revisit all towns in the same fashion that Shoushi has been revisited, and Yaraq and Holtburg will be revised in March and April respectively.

GREAT IDEA

We also would like to revise the difficulty and rewards of Marae Lassel, Aerlinthe, and the Vesayens in the same way that we revised the Singularity Caul. In each case the island and associated quests would be revised for new (not necessarily higher) target levels.

GREAT IDEA

We would like to revise the following quests: Palenqual’s Living Weapons, Singularity Weapons, the “Three Crystals Quests” (aka the Fenmalain, Caulnalain, and Shendolain Vaults), the Quiddity Weapons, and the Composite Bow and Crossbow.

GREAT IDEA

Better Weapons
In discussing the Treasure changes, we’ve mentioned that one of the reasons that the changes were necessary was to allow us to add cool new loot at the top end. What are we thinking of? We’re thinking of higher wield-req melee and missile weapons and wield-req casting items. To prevent these new items from throwing off existing damage-over-time balance, as well as PvP balance, we are looking at possibilities other than simply increased damage. One possibility is new, special imbue effects that cannot be added through tinkering, or – for the missile weapons and casters – special bonuses to specific types of elemental damage.

this has the potential to be very unbalancing, as well as angering a lot of people who worked hard to have "uber" weapons. In addition, melees already do tons more damage than mages, so war damage really needs to be vamped up before anything else...somehow

New Loot Armor
Right now the loot system has some rather obvious flaws when it comes to armor, such as when a high-level creature drops AL20 leather. We have held off on adjusting the armor drop system as we are looking at a complete revamp of it including new types of armor. We’re looking at adding a new class of armor for each of the three races. These new types would not be considerably better than existing armor, but would mix up the existing racial armor stereotypes. For example, perhaps the new Aluvian armor has metal protections like Celdon, but is a two-piece set like Amuli? These questions are still being investigated.

GREAT IDEA

Rares
Rares would be an entirely new type of loot drop, separate from existing loot and trophies. Rares would have an extremely small chance of dropping from any creature, at any time – you would be just as likely to find a Rare on a Drudge Prowler as you would on a Virindi Profatrix.

Please make these low value so that newbs on DT are not constantly getting hammered by 126s tryin to score easy "rares". Remember if the odds are equal no matter the creature, people might macro drudge skulkers for all you know

Further Buffing Improvements
In addition to accelerated self buffs and Fellowship spells, we are looking at introducing spells that buff multiple attributes simultaneously. These spells could be introduced for Life, Creature, and/or Item Magic. The exact details of these spells – how do you learn them, what is the cost, how many attributes do they buff simultaneously – are still in development.

honestly, some sort of autobuffer would be appreciated for those who don't want to run tank. Buffing doesnt really contribute to the enjoyment of the game.

Missile Attack Improvements
We are investigating two improvements for Bow, Crossbow, and Thrown Weapons characters:

Recalibrating the accuracy/speed slider. Currently setting the slider to the far left allows you to fire at maximum speed, but penalizes your skill by 50%. Likewise, setting the slider to the far right gives you a 50% bonus to your skill, but fires at the slowest rate.

We are investigating the possibility of adjusting this slider to allow for fastest speed with a smaller penalty – or no penalty – without changing the bonus given at slowest speed.

A new pathing type for missile attacks. War Mages have the ability to choose between Bolts and Arcs for the purposes of targeting, whereas missile users have only one option. We are investigating the possibility of giving archers a pathing option. This would likely be either through some sort of option in the attack bar, or through a new form of ammunition.

Archers need to see some sort of PVP and PVM payback for spending 16 credits (plus more than likely having to spec melee in order to compensate for no shield, as well as taking fletching). Good idea

We are investigating several ideas to increase the appeal of towns and increase the number of players that can be found in towns at any given time. Some of these ideas include some form of crafting bonus that can only be found in towns, or some form of capture-and-hold dynamic to appeal to PK and PKL players.

The towns mostly seem empty because they are all the same, so people tend to cluster in the few occupied towns. In addition the basically non-existant new player population leaves the "starter" towns as ghost towns. Add some landmarks or something, make each town truly unique...

Allegiance Improvements
We’re investigating a number of improvements to Allegiances in general. Some of these include allegiance officers with titles, more controls on who can and cannot enter an allegiance (such as account bans), better chat functions and controls, and the ability to name your Allegiance.
I seriously like the idea of titles that the monarch can confer on people, making them nobles of sorts and able to eject griefers on their own.

Mansion Improvements
We’re well aware that many players feel that Mansions are not worth their maintenance cost, and we are working on several ideas to make Mansions more valuable. Most of these are special hookable objects similar to Jojii’s Font.

hookable portals! nuff said

Pureblade

03-05-2004, 09:53 PM

I'm diggin these for sure! I love the idea of "Rares", I really do! Now THAT would make checking every corpse interesting for sure. I especially like that even lowbies can find extra special uber Rares to trade for better equipment from the high level people. This was actually a real dynamic that was lost as motes lost their value (early in my AC career as a newbie I found a mote on a golem at the beach and returned beaming to Hebian. I traded it to someone there, a higher level toon, for a nice little set of armor. It was throwaway for him, but uber for me!)

In terms of towns, I'd like to make a suggestion. Right now, going "PK" or even "PKL" has a very negative connotation going for it on the non-darktide worlds. The whole idea of going against Asheron's wishes is, unfortunately, a portion of the lore already, but I believe that going PK is not inherently an evil action, nor should be held as such. I was around during TD's defense of the shard and the PKs that held it were heros, not villians.

In that spirit I think it would be interesting to make towns capable of having "protector" allegiances, PKs or PKLs who serve to guard the towns from assault. On DT it is already a player driven dynamic, but I would like to see a more positive spin cast on it. For example, let's say that in the world you can only have 5 tinker-bonus hotspots. Those hotspots are focused onto a crystal that must be placed at town center, and only 5 exist. Only PKs or PKLs (perhaps PKLs control the lower towns) can move the crystals from place to place. Once in a town, that town receives the bonus. Perhaps there is also a special bonus given to the allegiance who placed the crystal there. Suddenly we have given the players a reason to stand guard, protect these crystals, fight for the right to have them in their towns. Making the bonus to the allegiance something powerful, like all characters in the allegiance gaining 10% more xp from monsters, would ensure constant struggle.

It would be very cool if, when you entered a town, it announced that it held one of the crystals and who the protectors were. I think such a dynamic would definitely make me visit an alter with my BM :D

TTF

03-05-2004, 10:05 PM

The missle pathing versatility change sounds great- IF, and only IF, it's an option on the attack panel. If it requires 7 new arrow styles to carry, it'd be awful. We archers have enough burden as it is. No rant about our burden, but lets not make it more combursome than it already is please :confused:

Rauth

03-05-2004, 10:10 PM

Fantastic :D

You guys have been incredibly busy for the past 2 months. Keep working on all of it!

Rivan II of WE

03-05-2004, 10:28 PM

Removing Settlement Portals is possibly the craziest idea you have had to date - and there have been some crazy ones!

You improved the game immeasurably by putting them in. We all have routes that we use via them. Frankly, how dare the team insist I have to run everywhere! If I want to explore by running around I will do - I don't need you to force me to,

I suggest you have a real re-think on this because if it comes in then that may just be the thing that makes me leave AC. Players like myself who don't have 20 hours a day to play AC rely on the quick transportation system in AC to get around. I didn't get to level 100 the hard way to be told to run everywhere like a new player!

Bad, bad, bad idea.

Rivan II of WE

Alissa

03-05-2004, 10:32 PM

W00T!!

Ibn that is, besides a ton of information, most reassuring that communication is up and running again.

It gives a bit of a long term outlook so we can see light at the end of the tunnel.

Thanks a bunch.

Avaton

03-05-2004, 10:34 PM

Originally posted by Rivan II of WE
Removing Settlement Portals is possibly the craziest idea you have had to date - and there have been some crazy ones!

You improved the game immeasurably by putting them in. We all have routes that we use via them. Frankly, how dare the team insist I have to run everywhere! If I want to explore by running around I will do - I don't need you to force me to,

I suggest you have a real re-think on this because if it comes in then that may just be the thing that makes me leave AC. Players like myself who don't have 20 hours a day to play AC rely on the quick transportation system in AC to get around. I didn't get to level 100 the hard way to be told to run everywhere like a new player!

Bad, bad, bad idea.

Rivan II of WE

I don't understand why you guys think this is bad?! Here is my take on the situation:

Now: Run all over the place hitting settlement portals to get somewhere.

After patch: Double-click on the settlement portal gem and "pow" you are there. No running.

You complain about having to run all over the place but the new way will remove most of the running!
Am I not seeing something here? I don't see how this is not lightyears better. Please explain.

Helbereth

03-05-2004, 10:36 PM

This might be a little off the topic, but:
-------------
"The second phase, currently planned for May, is the removal of the Settlement Portal Hubs entirely."

Ok it might be a nice idea in some ways pertaining to generating a new element for the economy (in the form of portal gems), but it will also make traversing Dereth - in general - a much more tedious and drawn out affair.

Before settlement portals were introduced, the most common way to get around was to aim in a direction on the map and hit 'Q'... walk away, make some phone calls, check the stock market, go see a movie, and then come back just as you arrive 50 clicks northwest of the place you thought you were aiming at.

Please don't make us do that again!

------------
"Envoys could make themselves available to uninscribe items upon request."

This seems like an opening for people to be dishonest.

I do have a few items inscribed by characters I've deleted, but inscriptions are a real easy way to determine who owns a particular item. If you make it too easy to get an inscription taken off of an item, you make it a lot easier for the unsavory types to pick an item off someone else's corpse then have their inscription removed so they can claim it as their own. That's not exactly something that happens every day, but there would need to be some kind of proofing system for whoever is asking for a UI.

--------------
"We would like to revise the following quests: Palenqual’s Living Weapons, Singularity Weapons, the “Three Crystals Quests” (aka the Fenmalain, Caulnalain, and Shendolain Vaults), the Quiddity Weapons, and the Composite Bow and Crossbow."

While you're at it can you go through some of the older quests and make their rewards hookable...? I stumbled on the Spear of the Given Heart Quest and thought it was pretty interesting... But I was rather disappointed when I got home and it wasn't hookable. To that end - and somewhat apart from the idea above - I'd like to be able to hang some of my old armor up. Shadow Armor would look great on my wall right over my Gaerlan Robe.

-------------
"New Loot Armor"

Well, this may simply come from my own creativity, but I think the suits you put on the undead critters (Revenants, Dark Revenants, Great Revenants and any of the others I might have not seen) would look great on my Aluvian Sworder, my Sho mage or even my Gharu'ndim Xbower. I'm not sure if you have some kind of quest in mind with it as some kind of reward, but it would make a nice addition.

Celdon, Amuli, Koujia, Yoroi, Platemail and Leather. The 6 basic food groups in a Dereth Armorer's Catalogue. It would be nice to have there be more options, but I'd like to make a small suggestion. There's an inherent problem between Amuli and Platemail Hauberks... you can't cross them without breaking it into 3 pieces. It would be nice if the new armor types were interchangeable. I.E. Make them fit together as a top and bottom piece.

Also I'd like to make a request concerning Leather Boots. When worn with Amuli (and even Koujia) It just looks wrong. I really don't think that people would be tucking those thick amuli pants into the boots in reality. It's much more likely that the amuli would be worn over the boots. This is a small complaint and you're probably looking at this and thinking "This is the stupidest thing I've ever read", but you have to understand I'm a freak. I have a pair of Major Sword Aptitude boots that i used to wear with my Plate/Celdon (top/bottom) combination armor. It - in that case - looked right. But I refuse to use those boots with the new Celdon/Amuli (top/bottom) set. Forgive me for my vanity but it just looks stupid.

------------
"“Second-class” Weapons Get Upgrades"

Yay! Does this mean I can actually look at an Ono without thinking, "Oh No! That's junk!" Most players have tolerances for the range at which they'll take a weapon... For me with axes it has to be at least 33 max damage or I don't even acknowledge its existance. Onos stopped at 32, hence I never bothered including the word Ono in my "Hey, check that out." response.

I don't know of any difference between the damage on swords (aside from the obvious rapiers, short swords, yaojis and simis), but maybe there should be. I could be completely wrong but Broadswords should carry more power with perhaps greater varience (further apart) than a Longsword. Tachis should be max damage with a tighter varience than a broadsword. Takubas should be max damage with an even broader varience than a Boroadsword.

----------
"Rares"

This sounds like an interesting idea. It would be nice to occasionally find something that's just plain wierd. You should consider having the items specific to types of enemies. Drudges shouldn't drop the same rarities as Virindi. As for the kind of items they drop I'm a bit at a loss.

Unusual healing kits sounds like a cool idea. Having a super-powered kit handy for those "OMG I have 2 Health left" moments would be nice.

You could consider different types of replenishment items. Stamina Elixers, for instance, that recover 130 stamina rather than the normal 65. Though to make them useful they would need to drop in bundles.

How about super-valueable items? Like an intricately carved and set diamond ring that's worth 100,000P. Keep it for that wedding you have planned or sell it for supplies, your choice.

---------
"In addition to accelerated self buffs and Fellowship spells, we are looking at introducing spells that buff multiple attributes simultaneously. These spells could be introduced for Life, Creature, and/or Item Magic. The exact details of these spells – how do you learn them, what is the cost, how many attributes do they buff simultaneously – are still in development."

Well, instead of attributes how about cluster buffs? When I buff it's usually for a specific purpose. Whether for crafting, tinkering, hunting or logging off, there's a specific set of spells I use.

Buff bots group together spells into sets of buffs for specific purposes. Hunting buffs wouldn't really work like this, but you could take trade skills (Lockpick, Cooking, Alchemy and Fletching) and clump them into one spell "Crafting". You could do the same with the 4 tinkering skills "Tinkering" and the allegiance skills (Leadership/Loyalty). You would have to cast the supporting attributes separately, but it would shorten your buffing time drastically. The spells themselves should probably cost a lot, but not as much as the 4 spells would cost separately.

----------
"We are investigating the possibility of adjusting this slider to allow for fastest speed with a smaller penalty – or no penalty – without changing the bonus given at slowest speed."

Well on the surface this would make PvM a much less arduous process especially for an xbower. But underneath there's a PvP issue lurking. Presently, it's possible for a mage to increase his/her defense against missile attacks by training missile defense forcing their opponent to use a higher accuracy setting.

Making it so the archer uses 100% of his skill at the lowest setting will make the mage's classically low missile defense skill utterly useless. I don't think mages who spend the credits and xp on missile defense for that purpose should be penalized any more than their low coordination and quickness.

I'd gladly give up some DOT on my Xbower to have a better chance in PvP with my mage.

-----------
"Housing barriers on Darktide. We are investigating possibilities regarding this issue. Some of these include removing all housing barriers, removing only mansion and villa barriers, or applying the PK timer to the house barrier in some way. Other suggestions, such as allowing the barrier to be temporarily destroyed in some way, appear to be too difficult to implement in the foreseeable future."

Ok this is a little too far. Making it so towns are a desireable, defenseable position is one thing. However, making it possible for people to raid your house while you're muling is a bit of an injustice - especially if you're incapable of defending yourself against the raiders. You'll have people camping settlements to kill mules repeatedly.

Back when everyone was drop muling, if your muling spot got raided you could easily pick it up and find a new tree. It's not as easy to pick up a cottage and move it to another field (I've tried it, trust me). This is an idea that comes from the level 126 (170+ adjusted) people who - having nothing else to do - like to camp starter towns to kill recently created characters. This, if implimented, will make your cottage a death trap. I'd rather mule under a tree.

-------------
"“Hidden” Properties No Longer Hidden"

What's it gonna say on the Quintessence Sickle (either one, PP or New)?

Helbereth

03-05-2004, 10:39 PM

Ok the problem is that you'd have to go to the settlement in order to get a portal gem to get there in the first place.

Make sense now?

If people want a quick way to get to a friend's house they could add a recall like /house <friends's name>_recall. Limited to people who are on that person's guest list, perhaps.

Avaton

03-05-2004, 10:54 PM

Originally posted by Helbereth
Ok the problem is that you'd have to go to the settlement in order to get a portal gem to get there in the first place.

Make sense now?

If people want a quick way to get to a friend's house they could add a recall like /house <friends's name>_recall. Limited to people who are on that person's guest list, perhaps.

So buy up a few for the portals you want before the portals go away and just keep your stock up like most people do with the Tusker Island gems.
So I have to run to the settlement the first time if I'm going to one I've never been to before... No big deal. After I get there the first time I can get back in an instant as long as I have a gem.

I still think this is WAY better than the current system.

Vehementi

03-05-2004, 11:03 PM

Agree/no comments about everything except:

- archer pathing changes should definitely be a config toggle, rather than an ammo type that people can just look at and say "oh, I have to dodge like THIS for now."

Oh, woops, this is the "in concept" thread. That is all. Good work on that part.

Khorps

03-05-2004, 11:11 PM

You only need one settlement gem.

Just buy another one everytime you use it. They guy will be right there when you materialize.

Less running, after the first time.

Are people really so lazy that they want access to settlements without having to go there once?
I didn't see people complaining that the settelement portals were hard to get to, and they weren't in town.

Helbereth

03-05-2004, 11:12 PM

I don't think it's better at all. I only have so much space to keep things muled. I did the Bobo quest so I wouldn't have to keep those gems. I use several settlement portals regularly, and I really don't feel like keeping a stock of gems for each one on ever one of my toons. And don't tell me to use my box. I use it for the 15 suits of armor(might be closer to 20), 5 xbows, ammunition, swords and other spare equipment that is too heavy for mules.

If they want to add portal gems for every single settlement, that's fine, but why remove the portals? I can't think of a single viable reason to make transportation a logistical nightmare. It simply doesn't make logical sense.

I can't think of a single problem they might fix with this change. And the "Ugly" reason is hardly an explanation. The rest of the things they listed - with a few exceptions - sound like they'll make great additions to the game, but this makes no sense.

Grayson

03-05-2004, 11:20 PM

Content Revisions:

Towns getting updated is a nice idea, particularily moving lifestones into town to encourage people to congregate there.

Island changes... :mad: "In each case the island and associated quests would be revised for new (not necessarily higher) target levels." I really don't like the idea of changing the target levels for the islands. ML is good for low and medium levels, Aerlinthe is good for medium levels, and the Vesayens are good for low to high levels. I'd rather see the content there change, but be directed towards the same level ranges.

The quest revisions look great. I was just thinking the other day that the Composite bow could use another retooling. And that goes triple for the Elari, which imo, is still the coolest weapon quest in the game.

Better Weapons:

Yuck. The change to the treasure system was a very nice kick in the pants to the upward spiral of player power. Please don't overdue these changes. Variety is good, but more power isn't.

Loot Armor:

I think new cosmetics are always popular. I'm guessing more people use Plate hauberk/leggings than use Celdon suits. Amuli isn't used as much for it's appearance as for the ease in baning and tinkering, imo. But, more options are always nice, assuming they aren't signifigantly better than current armor.

While you're at this, could you make the covenant girth dye to the same color as the other pieces? ;)

Rares:

Verrrrrrrrrrrrrry cool idea, as long as these items aren't particularily useful. A few suggestions off the top of my head:

a) Level VII gem buffs - perhaps 1-6 spells per gem
b) Stackable cantrip potions - Similar to the +100 stam/mana potions, but stacking with stats/skills, perhaps another +3 or so
c) Lifestone Summon gem
d) Healing kit that restores mana

One-shot items are, imo, the way to go for this. Greatly reduces the chance of an overpowering item being introduced, and you can always add permanent rares later on.

Buffs:

An often requested feature. Glad to see it getting consideration.

Missile Attack Changes:

I'm an archer, and I don't much like the sounds of that. Why change the speed? Archers definately don't need help in PvM. I can hear the pk crowd beginning to work themselves into a good frothing over it. (Although with mages getting missiled bonuses on wands, archers are likely hosed without it)

A new pathing would be nice, although other than homing, I can't figure out what it would be. An equivalent to a "Streak" would be very nice - something that cannot be dodged by zxc. Would definately help archers in PvP, and would make monsters with it pretty darn nasty in PvM.

Town Improvement:

Crafting bonus.. urgh. I'd rather see that at mansions than in town.

Capture and hold.. please do not do this. It's bad enough running into PvP in the marketplace all the time - encouraging it in town.. yuck. Might be a great idea for DT, but imo, a horrendous idea on white worlds.

As an idea - perhaps have items similar to what you're planning for mansion changes in town, and have them require a maintenance. If the playerbase pays the maintenance, the town gets the benefit of that item. Perhaps something like a large mana pool, or a Font of Joji. Imo, this would encourage people "living" in a certain town to grow into an actual community, instead of just a collection of people you occasionally see at the armorer's shop.

Allegiance changes:

Looks great.

Mansion Changes:

Very cool.

PK Changes:

<-- o.O

Web Integration:

We've gotten along for 4 years without it, so I hope it's not a high priority ;)

Helbereth

03-05-2004, 11:20 PM

Have you ever tried to run to a settlement from the town it's based in? Case in point : Azoroth Cottages is way up north a few clicks NE of the Beach Fort, but its settlement portal is in Qalaba'r. Granted you could start in Stonehold, but you'd have to get to Stonehold first. There are settlements in upper mountainous regions of Linvak that would be a polygonal nightmare to get to.

Also, I find questing to be long, depressing and pointless enough without making it twice as hard to get to the place. Exploring Dereth is a nice idea, but why we should be forced to hit 'Q' and walk away for half an hour is beyond me.

_AbBaNdOn

03-05-2004, 11:40 PM

Ibn your eyeballs must bleed after a long day on the boards lol. Alot of the concept changes are awesome and here are my opinion on the ones that most interested me.

-Settlement portals.. DONT TOUCH *smacks*. Those things are like secondary subway systems, I dont wanna have to buy stupid gems to get to them. free > paying to get some place. Maybe you got newbies in mind but learning the world of Dereth is a big part of the game.

-Aerlinthe,vesayen,marae lassel changes... Im not opposed to changing the landscape but would prefer them to remain the same. monster wise:

Vesayen islands would be an awesome place to make tougher. It should be a 60-80+ area. It lacks some deep dungeons.

Marae Lassel..? are you gonna make thicker spawns? I dont know what you can do there. for starters fix the portals. Put in some mutilator and swarm dungeons and some hollow olthoi dungeons. Hollow olthoi really need to be put into more dungeons and maybe make an eviscerator form. There graphics need to be changed just so the tips of their pincers glow too cuz they cause major lag. You guys stuck the undead on ML....thrown in some of those guys too?

Aerlinthe, that place has never held to much appeal to me, i guess i would say thin the spawns and keep them missle/mage orientated. After the rebalance i hunted there a few times but the loot and xp sucked.

--New armors. Other races DEFINATELY need 2 piece suits also. I think people would prefer a way to glue their armor together so they could make unique suits of armor but 2 piece suits other than amuli would be great to. Im still not gonna touch any other armor if it weights alot.

--Rare items.. as far as weapons.. what if they came with an imbue already on them and then you can still do 10 tinks which can include the attempt at a second imbue.

--Buff improvements. Make spells that buff all attributes at once for self and for other. Make a set that does all item spells for weapons and caster, bd,sk,def,attack, and manaC. Make another set that does all banes + impen. lifes that do all protections and armor for self and other. lifes that do all regens for self and other. All these spellgroups would be available in the different levels and they would NOT be more difficult than casting individually. Secondly they would absord 90% of ur mana when successfully cast which can be affected by mana conversion. This would make you have to refill your mana and im sure everyone could care less if it burns more tapers or scarabs. Debuffs will remain seperate.

--Town make overs. Do NOT have direct access to linvak tukal. That would be awesome to fight over on dt and i dont even play there. You need to cram vendors and a LS in the catacombs of opposition that place is awesome. Move the note guy to the area that has grubs, there are gaurds,muts, and vangaurds to both sides which would still make it challenging to get. What if turbine moves all mansions next to towns, like really close.

What are your plans for tradeskills?? monster trophies suck and the casino's are a joke. And a solo player cant tie to himself.

Helbereth

03-05-2004, 11:58 PM

"Secondly they would absord 90% of ur mana when successfully cast which can be affected by mana conversion."

Right up to there I was in agreement.

I really don't want to have to spend 429 mana (90% of 477) to cast 4 spells. That would bet just as annoying as the present system. What should be done is make it so casting them is, perhaps, more likely to burn a plat and costs more than an average spell (A lv 7 version would be like 150 Mana rather than 70).

Gafoon

03-06-2004, 12:15 AM

I have some MAJOR heartburn about removing the settlement portals.

The problem is that many of us (like Gafoon) have houses in desirable hunting areas (stonehold, olthoi north). If people want to hunt with Gafoon, all they need to do is to tie to Gafoon's housing portal and they can join him out hunting by his house.

But if you remove the settlement portals, that ability goes away - recalling to a settlement means that every time my wife wants to hunt with Gafoon, she's gonna have to go to a vendor and buy a gem to get her out to his settlement.

At a minimum, if the gems were usable like the master mage gems - they summoned a portal to the settlement instead of being a recall gem, and if the summoned portals were tyeable, that would make things much more reasonable.

sylphia

03-06-2004, 12:15 AM

I think this part of the new system is going to prove the most useful in preventing problems. Anything presented in this part is far enough out that it can be manipulated alot to both Turbine's and our satisfaction long before it hits the table for actual implementation. Items presented here pretty much cant come as a shock to players when (if) they finally reach fruition, as we have had at least 2 months to hammer out the details and get our say on what WE want to see. As I said, BETTER and EARLIER communication is always a positive step.

I am all for revamping towns in similar manner to Shoushi. The placement of portals and LSes never really made sense to me; it seems logical that the first inhabitants would have built their towns around the "safety" of the LSes and the conveniences of the portal drops, not off to the side of them. No real comments on the quest revamps, so long as you understand that bigger isnt always better, though different can be good.

Weapons; I will have to wait and see what kind of proposals you have in mind here before I can really offer any feedback on it.

Your planned changes to loot armor is all well and good, but you should adress the issue of low-AL armor dropping on high end mobs NOW. It may seem easier to you to do al lthe changes at once, but May is far too long to be lieaving such a poor functionality in the game. This should have a much higher priority. Do your revamps later, and fix the bug now. Then you can take your time with the revamps without having to worry about players getting ticked off over shoddy armor popping up on a mob it just tok them 10 minutes to kill. Really guys this shouldnt even need to be said, because its a no-brainer in my book.

Rares,
I like the idea in concept, but I dont really think you should have an equal chance of finding a particular rare item on a drudge slinker as you do on a cabalist. It woudl only encourage high level players to lay waste to the newbie content in order to increase their odds of finding those rares. Any rares dropped should be level appropriate, regardless of what they do. You might even consider upping the percentage chance of drops the higher in monster levels you go, to further encourage high level players to "stay where they belong". I guarantee you that if you put the same Cool Item X on high AND low level mobs, there will be lvl 126 toons camping all the newbie hunting grounds. We need LESS of that type of behavior, not MORE.

Multi-spell spells
This could be implemented in a similar way to what I propsed for GROUP BUFFS (http://forums.ac.turbinegames.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=6782&#post6782) For example, have the level 2 ATTRIBUTE SPELL cast all of the level one attributes on the target. Similar process all the way up to level 8's, which would cast the full suite of lvl 7 spells.

I think the individual weapon masteries and skills like Arcane Lore and Healing should be left that way, with their support attirbutes included. IE: SUPER SWORD 2= Sword Mastery 1, Streangth 1, and Coordination 1. Its unlikely that most toons will have multiple classes of weapons trained or speced so multiple weapon masteries would be a waste.

Now for other skill classes, like magic, tinkering, and tradeskills offer TWO versions of multi buffs:

Version One would work like the Weapon spells: you get the magic mastery + focus and self.

Version 2 you would get ALL of the magic schools and mana conversion. Tinkers would get all 4 tinker skills. Tradeskills would get Fletching, Cooking, Alchemy, and Lockpick. For life spells, you get all ELEMENTAL pros in one spell and all PHYSICAL spells + Armor in another; all 3 regens would be one spell.

Note than in all of these examples, Each multi-spell would be one level higher than the spells it actually casts. Again this would NECESSITATE the intorduction of Level 8 spells, but ONLY as a group and multi-buff set. All difficulties should should be appropriate to the higher spell set (lvl 2 multi-spell would cast level 1 spells but have difficulty of a lvl 2 spell) and should have a higher mana cost in general, but LESS than that of all the total spells involved in it. In other words, it should not be spellcost of Regen+Mana Renewal+Rejuv to cast the Renewal Multi-Spell; it should be closer to 2/3 of that.

Missile attacks:
I think you should focus on making the alternate firing methods a UI thing rather than an ammo thing. Mages have a distinct advantage in that all we have to do is tab to another spell bar or spell icon and we can switch off our types of spells as much as we like with no penealty, even changing out elemental or physical type if we want. When a melee or archer wants to switch their typem they have to equip a whole other weapon. For archers this is particularly cruel because of the need to go through all the combat stance animation AND reloading animation. And there are far too many incidences where the whole process bugs out and gimps the archer ina state where he can no longer attack. Make it a UI attack type option and keep it simple. The accuracy slider shoudl START at 100% and increase gradually to 150% Since Archers get hosed on HS and further dont actually get more damage per attack proportional to the additonal build-up time like mages and melees do, I think this is more than fair.

The idea of a crafting bonus in town is definitely an appealing one, but as I said before, this will only really end up having tinker/tradeskill bots set up in towns for those bonuses rather than in MP. There will certainly be more toons in town, but they will mostly be macroes working on skills or selling their services. WHich means we would start seeing portal storms and lag again, without the actual benefit of more real human interaction that comes with them. We dont just want to see more TOONS in town we want to see more PEOPLE in town :) Put more of the quest NPCs IN the towns, rather than on the outskirts or out in the middle of nowhere. For example, why on earth did you move the GSC Armorer down by the LS, rather than leaving him over the armorsmith? People come into Eastham and (assuming there is actually anyone IN town) ask where to find him, then immediately leave the township once told.

Mansion improvements:
More than long overdo; I got rid of my mansion long time ago becasue it was just a glorified, EXPENSIVE villa with the clan recall ability (before you could clan recall to villas), and a huge pain in the butt when it came to maintaining the rank "legitimately" without forcing patrons and vassals to break ties. Our new monarch has acquired a mansion again, but it still doesnt see enough use to warrant the extra expense in my view.

PvP:
(shrug) Do what you want I have washed my hands of it. Just stop borking PvM to cater to them, please. If making a change to PvP means changing a game mechanic, then apply it ONLY to PvP and leave PvM out of it. I am tired of having my choice NOT to PK being affected by changes to make those who DO PK happy. Did I mention you have ruined my Gems of Stillness for PvM?

Some folks will complain about having their account info tied in to forums and such, but I am for it. Then Envoys could tie issues and comments directly to accounts, without the risk of faked identification and impersonators. When a person is perma-banned form the game, they wouldnt be able to flood our boards with trash, since they would no lonegr have a valid account. They should be able to VIEW but not POST on the forums withotu an active account. However, Zone or account names should in NO way be viewable by non-administrative personnel. I specifically avoid chat rooms like the plaque in order to put that extra step of difficulty between me and a hacker. It woudl rather defeat the purpose if my forum info gave that out; the hackers woudl then at least have a real name to start with when applying their search software to crack the password.

OK I think thats about it. Thanks guys for adding this new communication. I will post more as needed :)

SynapticMisfire

03-06-2004, 01:10 AM

I've seen a lot of folks posting about how rares might be good, but shouldn't be too powerful, due to the possibility of high levels camping lower level critters.

Am I the only one that automatically assumed that when they said, "Rares would have an extremely small chance of dropping from any creature, at any time – you would be just as likely to find a Rare on a Drudge Prowler as you would on a Virindi Profatrix." that they meant the rare in question would be useful to the level of the player that would likely be hunting that critter? In other words, as some have discussed Diablo 2's rare and unique item system, there would be nifty neato rares for low levels, found on low level critters, and rares suited to high level players, found on high level critters.

Or is that wishful thinking? Perhaps my assumption was incorrect, but that's the way I took it. Not as a general "rare" class of drops that would all be of the same power level, but more customized to different ranges of player skill.

Otherwise, I think the changes look good. Settlement portal removal will take some getting used to, but as someone said, once you have a gem, you can use it and buy more once you get there. Besides, we lived without them for quite a while. =)

Also, as far as the login tied to both the game and the forums, I took this more to mean that when you logged into the game, similar to how we do now (obviously without the zone), you'd be effectively logged into the forums. Not shifting to a totally web-based forum-based system, as we've seen with other games.

My 2p.

Ss_

03-06-2004, 02:51 AM

Some of the Concepts I really like the improvements in melee/mislle weapon, new bonus's magic d/missle d, Armor changes (gets pretty boring everyone running around in same kinds of armor).

I have my doubts about several other changes, removal of settlement portals, replacing them with gems, nerf of gems of stillness, forcing us to carry even more of them. Playing a mage is bad enough as is in most instances pack space is a problem, and now Im suposed to carry even more items.

Additionally on the random no of spells they will dispell is even more frightining, In some of the higher areas Vod, Caul, some quests Its not un heard of to have 10-15+ neg spells on you some being repeats of coarse. So now with random no say you even max it out at 6 thats 3 gems to get rid of those spells.

If you plan on implementing this I would sugest you look at the way mobs cast neg spells. IE:so when your killing that mob of virindi you dont end up with the same spellls cast on you over and over!

Ive played this game for close to 4 yrs and have stuck through most changes you made good and bad. I enjoy the social aspects of the game as well as the ability to solo hunt when I choose.

Taker_AC

03-06-2004, 03:44 AM

Content Revisions:
Unless the Comp bow has a special property and is 130%... Don't bother...

Better Weapons:
Good concept.

New Loot Armor:
Please revamp Koija Armor... A rose by any other name still looks better then Koija leggings.

Rares:
Rares are good, but they cater more to the player that has alot of time to play, and not to a player that can only play 8 hours or less a week.

Further Buffing Improvements:
Perhaps combining multipul scrolls into a tome would be good compared to a new scroll that I would have to camp for.

Missile Attack Improvements:
Will hold my judgement.

Allegiance Improvements:
We’re investigating a number of improvements to Allegiances in general. Some of these include allegiance officers with titles, more controls on who can and cannot enter an allegiance (such as account bans), better chat functions and controls, and the ability to name your Allegiance.

Mansion Improvements:
No more junk... Just less cost. And fix the Housing Crystal bug while you are at it.

Web Integration:
YES! Get rid of passport!

Snorungen

03-06-2004, 03:50 AM

Most of these changes sounds interesting and will (hopefully) make the game more interesting again. It seems as if you put some focus on making the towns more usable again. Could you possible add some form of "post-office" where one can post items or messages to other players? I know this was frequent in the old time telnet muds and much used...
Keep up the good work, with these changes you propose the game will be even better!

The Darkness

03-06-2004, 04:29 AM

Very interesting idea on Rares. Will give new players the chance of finding tradeable items. One thought though - you state they will be cool and interesting, but perhaps not more powerful. It may be that if the rares arent useful the interest will wane after a few weeks/months.

So whilst I completely agree that they shouldnt be game alteringly powerful, what about if they were simply slightly better?

For example, say sword maxes at 24-40, well what if a Rare sword was 26-40?

Or Rare weapons were already imbued.

Rare armour could look different, eg glow like an energy crystal or pulse like a wisp heart (obviously I have no idea if any of these suggestions are remotely possible with the current tech!).

The possibilities here are endless - hats off for another great idea :D

Kilmor

03-06-2004, 05:06 AM

Removing settlements portals because "they do not look pretty" has to be the worst reason ever given. Sorry, I do not need another 10 non stackable items to fill up my already limited pack space. Gems are a bad idea.

PLEASE RECONSIDER THAT.

Rares: Lovely, I'll look forward to that.

Modifierers on casters: PRETTY PLEASE NO? ANYONE HOME? For a more detailed reaction, look at the PvP boards. I mean seriously, I might be able to understand a melee mod on a staff, but getting an evasion bonus for carrying around a crystal ball (aka Orb) or a stick (aka Wand)?

Khaz-Modaan

03-06-2004, 07:15 AM

Stick of parrying, fool :p

-----

I love that you guys are coming to us with more information, definitely refreshing from what I'm used to. I've already had my rant on the other feedback thread, so I'm going to try to find something good on this Follow-Up article ;)

Heh, and of course, the first thing I don't like... Settlement Portal changes. Y'know, if you made the settlement portal gems available in the towns that they were based in, it might not be such a bad idea, buuut I dislike what I think I'm seeing. I don't want to run to each and every settlement portal that I think I may go to at some point and time just to get around... consolodate where they are located, and I'd be ok with it... just don't have us running all over creation, because a lot of players (myself included) do not have a lot of packspace. If you made them all available in the town they are attached to, most of those are easily accesible, and you don't need to bog up the room in your backpack.

I understand the need to change the dispell gems/potions, but, if you do make them less useful as a whole, please allow us to stack them, I think it's only fair.

Love the faster buffing idea, not much I can add onto there, except that I might like group banes, but I think you cover that later in the Follow-Up.

I think it's a great idea to bump the second class weapons up to useable... before, as was mentioned, some just weren't worth looking at.

Better weapons? I'll have to wait until you elaborate a bit more to really know where I stand, but I think that it could possibly be a right idea, if you impliment it right.

Love the idea of new loot armor... especially the idea of making some of the classically cumbersome armor less of a trouble to bane. Could be very interesting.

I like the idea of rares, as long as they are kept level-appropriate for what they are being found off of. You should not be able to find the same quality of rare off of an Obeloth lugian as a Titan :)

Missile changes: I agree that missile might need a bit of tweaking for PvP purposes, but removing the accuracy penalty is not the way to go about it, for the reason stated above (low coord/quick is already a penalty for a lot of mages). Perhaps you shouldn't make it so drastic of a penalty, but there *should* be some kind of penalty. Also, on the note of pathing - I think UI would be the way to go... though I could see ways of working around the bulkiness that extra ammo could create.

Allegiance improvements: *Please* let me ban accounts out of my allegiance. I like all of the ideas, but if you do nothing else, account bans would get my vote. I also really like the idea that my mansion may be useful, and not just eye candy that costs 10 writs and a million pyreal per month, plus rank.

PvP:

Taking a look at and adjusting the DoT for the rarely-used weapons of former mass destruction (hollow, phantom) would be great... though I'm not sure exactly how you would impliment it. I'd like to see more on this as time goes on.

Jumpspin... as long as you give people a viable way to escape, great.

That's all for now, I think I'm too tired to re-read and see if I missed anything :)

Jaspo

03-06-2004, 08:25 AM

Very nice letter. Typically communication of this nature lasts 1 month and then fades away. I hope it continues.

--------------------
Rares would be an entirely new type of loot drop, separate from existing loot and trophies. Rares would have an extremely small chance of dropping from any creature, at any time – you would be just as likely to find a Rare on a Drudge Prowler as you would on a Virindi Profatrix.
--------------------

I have always been a trophy hunter. Since creature redistribution and the increased drop rates of rares, trophy hunting has been horrible. Way too high of a drop rate. In one pass of the linvaks I have come away with several tundra robes, ursuin coats, 3 or 4 smalls, crystal swords .... just way too much. The hoary matty hide drop rate is about perfect and is a good metric for the others.

Very few trophies in the west dires (ayan). Should be a lot more.

Rares such as harbinger items are fun, but there needs to be a greater turn in reward. Not necessarily xp or money, but useful items. Use yellow jewel and vapor hearts as a model. Think blue gem ;-P

Consider a possibility of "Degrading" rares. Weapons and armor that degrade based upon a counter. After n hits upon the armor it is destroyed. This will allow you to create temporary unbalancing weapons and armor.

--------------------

StabA

03-06-2004, 08:28 AM

Nice step you guys are making with this, I love it.

Dom on TD

03-06-2004, 09:49 AM

"We are investigating several ideas to increase the appeal of towns and increase the number of players that can be found in towns at any given time."

1)I never noticed towns being empty until you introduced the marketplace. Find some incentive for buffbots to move back to towns, and they'll be populated again. It would also decrease lag in the MP.

2)Bring back the invasions. I waited for hours for the statues to spawn, or the elementals to attack. Dozens of us would sit around in fellows, talkin smack and saying who was gonna get the kill. It really brought out the social aspect of the game.

3)Give us Abandoned Mine and Jungle Shadows recall quests. Everyone uses Hub/Sub to get to the towns, but who wants to waste a portal tie? We'd rather gather at mansions/villas because we can all get there easily.

4)Put "lockers" or some type of secure storage system in the towns for people without residence, and make the purchase and maintenance writ free.

In conclusion, I love this game, and I would like to see the towns come back to life as well.

Grrr the Mad

03-06-2004, 09:54 AM

I believe the removal of settlement portal hubs will decrease exploration, not increase it. However, if I'm correct in assuming that all settlement portals are located near towns, why not add a dungeon to all towns where you can purchase those same gems inside AND/OR run a quest within that allows you to obtain a hookable portal for a given settlement.

You have talked previously about hookable portals and about making mansions more useful. This could serve both purposes, though restrict it to a monarch's house, not a mansion.

I love the idea of giving every town a reason to be there and one unique unto itself. As a long time player, while I was as glad to see housing come in as much as anyone it killed the towns. I miss that old feeling of being gathered in towns, near the blacksmith or wherever, and chatting with not only guild members, but members of other guilds.

Not meant to be a rant but... archers.. er.. missile characters do need some improvements. Okay, at lower levels they probably still outlcass the other professions, but at higher levels, you almost might as well sellback and change to mage or melee.
Why?

Advantage #1 now gone - Archers were the only ones who could attack something behind a hill or other obstacle. With the advent of arcs, mages now do this.

Advantage #2 now gone - Archers only needed one bow to be able to do all damage types. While that remains true, it's all about the RR's now, and therefore, you need to carry 7 bows. Which, if I'm not mistaken are probably heavier than most melee weapons. This also means, for the possible new pathing... not more arrow types!

Advantage #3, which really has never been an advantage at higher levels anyway - Ranged attack. Without the ability to have or add an attack bonus to missile weapons, you could only improve via buffs to skill and the accuracy bar. If you're hunting within your skill range you're hunting at max accuracy all the time anyway.
- The problem here is, there are very very few critters, especially at higher levels, that don't charge when you attack them, and most of the time it's mobs to boot. What this means is, you get ONE shot, MAYBE 2 if you're lucky, before the mob is upon you. And from max distance, there's a good chance you're going to get evaded anyway.
- So suddenly ranged characters are in a melee situation without the benefit of the wall that melees get to carry. And when I take my melees out, I'm always amazed at what a huge difference that shield makes. Ping.... assailer grazes your hand for 1 pt of bludgeoning damage....
- The real advantage that IS gone now though is, the more deadly of the melees... sword, axe, etc, are now dishing as much or more damage as an archer is while taking far less themselves with about the same ability to hit, or better as they have attack bonuses, while essentially getting the same number of quality attack chances.

Maybe you need some flying creatures that are actually too high for melees to hit? :D

I'm actually a little tired of the better weapons tactic, as it usually means they now do more damage. I would like to see improvements in other ways. For example, dagger was uber in the days of triple strike, before tinkering. Now that that's gone, they are less than 2nd class citizens. Do I think dagger should be able to cut things down as fast as sword or bow or a mage... no. But it would be nice if it didn't take 30 seconds longer than everyone else. But instead of higher damage dirks, etc.. why not tweak dagger's chances at critical strikes a little so that they have a better chance than sword or axe or what have you at comparable skill levels.

Overall, I'm not upset too much about the loot changes right now. I figure A) it's a process B) it's a cycle. I'd actually like to see where for a period of time every year we cycle from high work-high value, to low work-low value and back again. Either that, or add a tinker that reduces workmanship. Reduce by 2 if it counts as a tinker, by one if it doesn't. Everyone wants to max tinker their stuff of course. If you don't, why set the limit at 10? Why not 5? Why even set a limit? If someone wants to take that 5% chance of success on a max damage, fire rendered sword for a 12th tinker, why not let them? Sooner or later, they'll stop themselves, or blow it up.

Ack... I rambled. Later... oh, good work guys.

"Grrr the ___" many of HG

Zero_Washu

03-06-2004, 09:59 AM

Missile Weapon

Make it something selectable from the panel and not requiring re-loading the weapon. I don't think an ammo change is needed.

If you need a new animation I suggest bows be fired horizontal, atlats side swing, and x-bows hip fired!

This change could be for changing the accuracy bar or allowing flat trajectory shots.

As for new elemental damages/etc...

Do Slayer properties instead, and make them imbues.

Ot Wintersebb

03-06-2004, 10:27 AM

Kudos to Turbine for opening up the communications.

Fivepack

03-06-2004, 12:31 PM

I think your changing the whole game and thats a mistake, why not just make a new game and let the people decide if they want to play that one or the old one.

Laters Fivepack :confused:

Tektek

03-06-2004, 12:54 PM

Oops.. *moving post to development thread, not concept :P*

sionwarwick

03-06-2004, 01:04 PM

It would be really nice for the mansion owner to allow another user (or two) to be able to access hooks and rearrange decorations.

Our allegiance is largely military folks, many of whom are gone on duty and have been for a long time. We can maintain the mansion and use the chests but can't redecorate. Those of us still at home are stuck with a mansion that was last decorated over a year ago and we can't add new useful stuff like the Font of Jojii.

The fellow who owns the mansion did share his account when he was called up, but now the others who had his password are gone as well. I also know that when he was around his play time was limited and he didn't always appreciate getting pulled away from hunting to redecorate. In this way the task can be assigned to folks who like doing that sort of thing. I am only asking for this on Mansions, not other housing.

Morganvale, Leafcull

sionwarwick

03-06-2004, 01:17 PM

The wording was a bit confusing, but I'm assuming that Settlement Gems will be available indefinately? Or was it just for a month? Will they be available in town, or at the settlement itself?

If you only have gems for a month or make them only available at the settlement, and remove the portals entirely, you have just removed one of the main ways I've had to explore Dereth. You'd be hindering, not opening, exploration. Similarly, if the Settlement Gems are difficult to get or exhorbitantly expensive, you will be hindering travel. I don't have room to mule a hundred different gems. You've made relying on these portals necessary for many of your "running around" quests which you are so fond of lately (the last thing I need to do in my limited play-time before a quest is quest for portal gems...sheesh).

I've muddled through alot of the changes over the years, for good and bad, but have to say that this one would completely ruin the game for me and I'd have serious doubts of continuing.

Dispell gems/potions/spells.
1-I must admit I'm not thrilled with the dispells only removing a small number of spells. I burn through enough gems as it is.
2- How would this affect the Awakener?
3- I would recommend that the potions be equally potent as the spells. Otherwise its yet another unfair focus on having to take magics. While I appreciate that those who have dumped skill credits and xp into magic schools would like to see some benefit over those that don't (they get lvl VII's after all), its seeming more and more like its not a choice anymore, if you want to survive at higher levels. And I "wasted" a character slot for a crafting mule, so sacrifice has been made there as well that should see some benefit.
An example of magic caster benefit: more monsters are casting lvl VII debuffs. With a character that wears her protections on clothes/jewelry/armor the best I can get is VI's, so I'm guaranteed to be running at a protection deficit which is pretty much a one-shot-kill situation in the uber areas. In order to hunt VoD and similar areas, I'm obliged to beg/bot for lvl VII protects.

Grey Bow of FF

03-06-2004, 01:59 PM

Rares
The kill rate of monsters on DT is out of wack. If you stop all of the UCM people there, then they would be well below the normal rates on the other servers.

This would factor in to the system with a rarer being dropped there less than say on HG.

New Loot Armor
I hate to open up a Evis and to find an AL20 Leather helm, a couple of gems, a few pyreal, and a low end weapon--if I am that lucky a low-end convenant armor.

Usually, I dont get that much.

Mansions
Lets fix things that are very wrong before changes in the Mansion borders are considered.

Fix the invisable players at the mansion bug first.

Back to the recommended changes...Mansion or housing borders are used to buff yourself prior to a battle. Abet they are used for hiding behind too, but that should not be considered a bad thing as you can not cross the border with missile or magic to hit your opponent.

Removing the borders would mean that an enemy could camp your recall gem drop and kill you as soon as you materialize, since you are at peace coming through the portal.

Rockhound

03-06-2004, 02:05 PM

First off I also need to congratulate you guys on this new communication idea. It's nice to see what you're planning to throw our way.

I really like a lot of the ideas I'm seeing or at least am open to give them a shot. There were a couple that I wasn't the biggest fan of...

1. The settlement portals. I agree with a lot of what I've seen in this thread. They make moving around the game easier and not everyone has a lot of extra pack space available. If it is necessary to move to a gem system for them maybe just have one guy sell gems to all of them and then stash a guy in each of the heritage capitals. That would still get rid of the "ugly" portal groupings and quite possibly even speed up the ability to move around for people.

2. New pathing for archers. I like this option and again agree with the general board idea that it should be a check box and not different ammo. On top of the extra burden, which is very very bad! that would be added by new arrows there are some serious threats from this too. If an archer is using an "arc" arrow to hit a creature that's over a hill they'll get one or two shots off and then that creature will be on them. Then, they will have to exit combat, switch arrows, enter combat and then be able to shoot. That's a lot of time where you're not attacking and very vulnerable to getting beat to death.

3. I'll give you full fledged support for the buffing speed up. That is definitely one of the least attractive parts of the game but also one that is completely necessary. To add on that idea, I'm not sure exactly how you would do it, but some way to speed up banes would be wonderful. Speeding up the creature and life buffs will help, but I usually notice that the bulk of my time is spent baning armor if I'm headed anywhere dangerous. If there were some way to lump together elemental banes as one spell and physical banes as one and leave impen to itself or something like that would make life tons better. I'd ask for one super bane spell but that's probalby getting a little too greedy! I'll leave this for you guys to figure out, for now the upcoming buff improvements are much appreaciated.

4. Less important, but if you are going to reduce the power of the dispell gems definitely make them stackable. For now I can deal with the lost space because they do so much but if they only remove 1-6 spells many more will be necessary to do the same job and there just isn't enough room in the packs for it.

Other than that it's promising stuff. Keep up the good work.

Rivan II of WE

03-06-2004, 02:15 PM

Ok lets explain this fully. At present I make log on and just fancy doing an old quest or maybe something from a previous patch. This is because I don't have the time to explore every aspect of a patch or - wait for it - I might not be at that level yet. Ok so now we have that sorted out lets move to the next point.

I fire up a nice website that works out for me how to get from A to B via the handy housing portals. Now bear in mind TURBINE not me said these housing portals would improve the game and help players get round quicker. Yes they did folks it was not me honest. So I won't have the relevant gems stocked because this was just something I decided to do when I logged on. I have been on the game long enough to remember when Town Gems were needed what a mess that was.

When you compare AC with other MMORPGs it's the portal system which gives it the edge for the casual player. It makes getting round more fun especially for a semi-casual player like me.

As for the "they look ugly excuse" pleeeeeeaaaase that's so lame it's six feet under. Since when have changes been made because things looked ugly in AC? I would love to know exactly how many times Turbine have been told that the housing portals spoil the look of the game by players. Because frankly my dear I am not buying that one. I have never heard anyone in the game saying, "this game sux because those housing portals just look so nasty in the landscape!" Are we dealing with a rogue element of Greenpeace players here that none of us have met?

I am sorry but if this thing is implemented then all the other good stuff you are doing will be significantly lessened because it will just drive semi-casual players off - we don't have the time to buy gems, keep as stock of them or whatever. Just count this as a "blue sky" idea that seemed ok at 1:00AM in the morning but in the cold light of day needs ditching. You know thats the right thing to do.

Rivan II of WE

DadgaSilverhand

03-06-2004, 02:21 PM

about the local islands upgrades?

Vesayian islands, please keep it in level range of 20 to 60, but not +80 types. (Ithanic island- keep it at +60)

Marrae Lassel, let keep it remain same but need few extra dungeons for most levels. we had enough bug dungeons, just want to see Tumerock culture related quests (Hea vs Aun), we know there is some secrets hidden under that island, the Order of Raven Hands is one of it.
Garriane the Emperior is hidding somewhere.
some Mosswart quests, by adding the mosswart village on far east of ML. (non-hostle tribe)

Arilenthe Island, questable for +45, but it is +60 territory, either tone down the heavy spawns or upgrade the spawns by removing heavy spawns. (need to redo the Infusion quest, it is hard to get one at Mt. Espar crater and Mt. Lethe crater, ruined by Xp jumpers), Arefalle quest? that all it have, let add few more other quests, need something with eastern shore.
including Gromnatross Nest/Arie concept. (egg recovery quest) by restoring the egg back to the nest, Hint hint.

BlackOrdun

03-06-2004, 02:31 PM

With the changes in Loot, we have been told to roam farther afield to find monsters that carry the type we expect to find. My wife and I have done that, by using the Settlement Portals. We already have several we visited on a regular basis to get to areas that, before the settlement portals were implemented, took us literally hours get to by running. =) Try running from Mayoi to Kara sometime.

For those that think we are being lazy, I must disagree. Back in February of 2000, I took my 20 something and ran from Uziz to Plateau and back. Took me days LoL, everything out there seemed like it wanted a piece of me, and often got it. While that was interesting, I have no desire to go back there. If I did, the portals have no bearing on my decision to run.

The Settlement Portals do not require one to use them, but provide - for those of us who cannot spend 80+ hours a week in game - a way to shortcut the tedium vitae and have fun. If they are "ugly" take them into a level in the meeting halls perhaps... But on its own, "ugly" is no reason to remove them.

As a soon to be 2 school archer, I have precious little pack space, and simply have no desire to stuff another pack full of gems for the 5 or 6 settlement portals we regularly utilise, not to mention Celdiseth, and Tusker Isle. Since we only hunt in pairs, finishing the BoBo quest for two archers is nigh impossible for us. No recall spell = carry gems = no pack space = sad archer :( ...

The enhanced information is wonderful. I truly appreciate not being hit with a stick by a new patch!

As for Town Love, I cannot agree with hordes of PK protectors as was suggested by a player, nor do I desire a repeat of the patch I thought was the absolute worst in the history of the game - the Elemental Invasion of towns <sigh - lag, lag, lag, and more lag> as another player suggested. Perhaps you could make it so that items stay longer in the vendors inventories again. I check the vendors every time I come into town, lots of players don't because any "good" item tends to disappear quickly.

Maybe bring chess closer to towns...

Also someone suggested bringing the LS and portal drops back into towns. I was in the game with my eldest toon November 1999, I can remember the horrendous lag of hordes of newbies portaling in and being sent to the LS (and with only 3 starter towns now the problem will be exponentially exacerbated). Leave 'em outside, especially if the new server comes online.

I feel strongly enough about the possible removal that this is my first post, I was able to adapt to the last patch, but I don't feel that the proposal to remove the Settlement Portals is one that is well thought out.

Black Ordun

2-legit

03-06-2004, 02:47 PM

http://forums.ac.turbinegames.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3962

Arch Magi

03-06-2004, 02:52 PM

The 30 day timer on housing purchases is SPOT ON great. This is how I proposed it should be done on vnboards.

Removing housing settlement portals isn't the greatest thing, but if it does SOMETHING (ie reduce lag, or free up resources for new dungeons, then go for it). If it is just to make the world "better looking", then I'm not buying it. Just move the portals into the Town Meeting Hall and poof, the problem is solved.

Personally, I think that Turbine should remove the "Subway" and "New subway" and EXPAND the town portal ring network to include all towns. A portal for 1 or 2 other towns that dumps out into another town is not only logical, but more useful.

From a story point of view, why would the Queen set up more portals (ie housing portals) yet have town transportation network require you to jump down a 100 pit filled with monsters. Merchants would rather be able to drive carts and walk in and appear in another town. Just more logical.

But for GODS SAKE, don't take the subways away WITHOUT expanding the portal rings. THAT would be a HUGE mistake.

Also, you may want to clarify IF those portal gems that can be gotten during that month will expire after a period of time (ie you are going to remove the code for the exit portal at some time).

KeeTana

03-06-2004, 03:13 PM

Bad, bad idea!

First, I do NOT believe your player base complained about ugliness. I simply don't believe it. A bunch of portals is no uglier than a single portal. In fact, I think it's an interesting visual.

Actually, on DT, the settlement portals can be a pain; since I am melee, a player I am trying to PK can lead me a merry chase thru these portals and I have occasionally gotten sucked in. But I have learned to deal with this, and am MUCH more willing to deal with it than I am the lack of settlement portals.

This will absolutely discourage, rather than encourage exploration; so let's throw that 'reason' out. So ... ugliness and exploration aside, what's the reason for taking away something the players find useful?

I, as someone else mentioned, also log on with the thought of going someplace new. If I have to first hoof it to the settlement to get a settlement gem, I'm not going to do it. I also sometimes log on AFTER my guildmates have started an adventure, a settlement portal often lets me join them. If I don't already have the gem, I'm out of luck.

I spent time on mules/minor characters getting them to the point where they could cast additional portals for me/guildmates. You have just wiped out my efforts.

I just don't get how this is an 'improvement'!

-----------------

I also hate the thought of housing barriers coming down. We have had issues with people losing stuff in housing chests, so we have to keep the really good items on mules. Now you are making it, on DT anyway, so people can come in my house and whack my mule with the good stuff. WHY????

----------------

Having gotten those issues off my chest, I too want to add my kudos for opening up this type of dialogue!

LeifThorssonJr

03-06-2004, 03:43 PM

Further Buffing Improvements
In addition to accelerated self buffs and Fellowship spells, we are looking at introducing spells that buff multiple attributes simultaneously. These spells could be introduced for Life, Creature, and/or Item Magic. The exact details of these spells – how do you learn them, what is the cost, how many attributes do they buff simultaneously – are still in development.

More information on this topic will be in the upcoming Buffing Improvements article.
__________________________________________

Beautiful! Finally, support mages will have a reason to exist at high levels.... make the multi-attribute spells harder to cast, like 325, 350, 375, 400 difficulty (for level 7's), so that my grandpa mage can buff others and himself faster than a 10-10 starting focus self sword toon.... make a REASON to spec item... would be nice to cast one spell to do impen/bludge/slash/pierce and one for elemental protects.... would cut down baning time by 75%...

also, this would eliminate some of the desire for level 8 spells, as maxed out mages really have only one use for their incredibly high magic skill..... PK. once you hit about 275 base in any magic school, you rarely fizzle, so why increase it, other than bragging rights? in addition, this would not unbalance gameplay, as it would only speed up buffing, and not increase abilities....

if it worked out, maybe you could even do multiple vulns? like imperil/vuln combos would be great, or blood loather/brittlemail... i don't suggest going over 2 spells at a time for negative spells though.... i would suggest that difficulties on multiple negatives start at 75 above the base difficulty for a single positive spell of that level.... so for 7's, 375 diff for a double.... and 400 for a triple, if triples allowed...

for people posting on ideas that are in development, or coming in march, please post them in that thread, so that all three threads don't get jumbled together...

Stavenger

03-06-2004, 04:20 PM

Great Ideas! Thanks to Ibn and Turbine for fostering this kind of communication.

I particularly like your ideas on Rares and Town changes.

Rares:

Great Idea. One of the best things about AC is thrill of opening a corpse and finding something cool. Some people have raised some concerns about how this could be implemented, specifically that high levels might macro drudge skulkers to find rares. This could be alleviated somewhat if Rares are level appropriate. Also, consider making the drop percentage tied to the number of critters killed in a given loot profile. You have said there are 6 loot profiles. For example, if a macroer (or players in general) is/are killing thousands of critters in loot profile 6, that could increase the rare drop rate in the other 5 loot profiles. That way, the newbie hunting level 3 loot monsters would have a better chance of finding a Rare. He might actually benefit from the level 6 loot profile being over-hunted.

Town changes:

I miss seeing people in towns. The crafting bonus idea is a good one. To avoid a crowd of macroers, a spell-like timer could be applied to the buff for a given town. For example, a player would get a bonus in town X for a half hour. He would not be eligible to receive another half hour buff from town X for 3 hours. He could, however, move to town Y to receive a half hour buff . This would keep people moving around to different towns.

Another thought on towns and crafting buffs involves Monarchies. Consider each Allegiance member in town increasing the crafters skills by three points, to a maximum of 15. So, 5 Monarchy members (to avoid portal storms) would give you the maximum benefit

ImpaleHG

03-06-2004, 04:37 PM

A post I saw somewhere else that seemed worth mentioning as a suggestion (may even be in this thread, but it's too damn long to read).

Why not move settlement portals into the meeting halls in each town? Would give them back some use and the halls certainly could be redesigned slightly to hold the portals within in way that could still be visually appealing.

Regalo

03-06-2004, 05:08 PM

First! Is this just a ruse covering the fact that folks like Niro would also have to take the time and effort and make the pack space to have all the portal gems so it would further slow down his enterprise??

The bad points;

Unless they stack you can't hang on to a good number of them. For most folks pack space is at a premium. I think all gems should be stackable anyhow. Holding onto Aphus Lassal gems takes room which it shouldn't.

The settlement hubs aren't even visible from the towns in most cases so who is whining about them being ugly?? You don't see them day in day out.
I didn't see a post asking us if we wanted them gone or changed because we thought they were ugly.

Why not make a little building you enter that contains the portals in it??

Why must we go to the settlement first to get the gems? Or if a friend goes can they buy them and hand them over to us??

I can use my various accts and chars to tie to portals I guess but what about folks who only have one acct?

Regalo

03-06-2004, 05:09 PM

You keep saying the towns should be busier.
Agreed.
But what about portal storms?? And Lag??
Would you also be making it so we don't get stormed out of the towns??
I remember when our guild met and held meetings and socialized in the pub in Hebian-to. We were constantly being stormed away. It was very annoying.. We had to switch to the Hebian-to Library and that even got bad.
Thank goodness they made the meeting hall.

Ideas folks have put forth asking that lockers or chests or whatever be added in or near the towns for storage seem feasable as long as you could permit chars from your other acct or your friends acct access.
It would 'maybe' alleviate some of the competition of getting a villa. But only if you were allowed to have more than one chest or if it would be able to contain extra backpacks.

Or even make the chests we now have in cottages and apts. so that they can hold more than one extra pack.

LeifThorssonJr

03-06-2004, 05:24 PM

i don't really know if this is the right place to make a suggestion, but i figure it is about concepts, so i'll give one of my own....

change the derived stats that tinker armor comes from...

currently, it is set to endurance and focus.... this is stupid. the only types of toon that can even begin to think of maxing endurance are mages, or dedicated tinkers... and making a dedicated tinker is kinda lame too, since you can't spec any tinker skills.... so the best thing is use a tradeskills mule.... but tradeskills mules usually have maxed str, coord, and focus...

str, so they can hold all kinds of parts/components/elixirs/etc.
focus and coord so they can be good at tradeskills (cooking/fletch/alchemy).

why a MAGE would be good at tinking ARMOR is beyond me. please consider making armor tink be a function of str and focus, so we only have to ruin one character slot with a non-playable (no hunt) toon. or coord and focus, but that combo already has a ton of benefit, so str/focus is the better alternative....

i understand that you guys made it endurance to give some love to the endurance gimps we used to have running around... but some attributes are just destined to be less useful... in this game, those are endurance, quickness, and willpower.... they may need some love, but please, reconsider this type of "love"...

i also realise that lots of people would be upset with this, as they have maxed out tinkers....

to counter this, i would propose that in the first month after the change, you allow (only for that month, and only toons with armor tink trained before the patch) everyone with armor tink to move all endurance to an attribute or attributes of their choice.... (in 99% of the cases, it would be to coord, since dedicated tinkers gave up item tink for the armor tink skill)

thoughts? opinions? flames?

LeifThorssonJr

03-06-2004, 05:33 PM

Originally posted by Regalo
Or even make the chests we now have in cottages and apts. so that they can hold more than one extra pack.

i know that enabling extra packs in chests exponentially increases the amount of DB size that you guys need, but really, is it unreasonable for us to expect that a chest should be able to hold just as much as a toon? with the way it is currently set up, that would equate to holding 10 packs, and the 26 slots in the main part of the chest, give or take a few slots....

if chests had that much storage, i think alot fewer people would NEED cottages/villas/mansions, as an apartment would do very well for them....

Crevanor

03-06-2004, 06:43 PM

Hey Ibn!

First, I think it is an excellent idea to list potential changes apriori; it should definately help cut down on frustration and misunderstandings.

Starting with the important topic: Hurry up the new armor and the rares! Sounds awesome! :D

Next, I loved the idea that Ozio had about a barrier generator. It got me thinking to make the system more dynamic, whether the generator concept is considered or not. The dungeon portal should be accessed more easily in the mansion. Very true, it's nice going down to the dungeons, but it's a complete was of time. Move it closer to the covenant stone, so people will use it more often. That said, the dungeon will be usable again, probably by the mules and tinkerers, where they will be safe.

Also, I like the changes going throughout all the items, but want to focus on mages for a bit, since I've always been a mage-oriented player (though I do have a swords and an archer too). I don't think the + melee D would be terribly popular personally. I can't think of many character with war magic that has either their cord or quick above 10. So, while their are a few mages who do take the melee d trained route, I wouldn't consider the bonus they receive very significant. It would be nice, however, to have toe defender spell applicable to the orbs, as there are such characters. What I think would be a lot more useful would be a + to war skill and/or magic D. I don't see any argument why there shouldn't be a +war skill modifier, other than coding difficulty perhaps. It seems that you have already considered the +magic D, so I encourage you to work on that too! (but faster) :p

Also, partially indifferent to the stam <-> health <-> mana changes.

I do, however, think that war magic should have something added to it.

I do want to say this though. The thing I love about my archer is that I can predict how much he's going to hit for (barring crits), and so I know safely when a critter is near dead. This makes it much easier to push the limits of my archer's health vs critter's health. My mage, on the other hand, hits slow and powerful. That, in addition to the broad range of his attack value, makes it very difficult to discern whether it was relatively safe to go for a finishing blow or to heal instead. I was wondering if it was possible to add spells that hit for more consistent damages. A range of 110-180 is very broad, especially post-vuln.

Thanks again for posting your plans in advance!

-Crevanor

Crevanor

03-06-2004, 06:47 PM

Another idea I thought up just now, with regards to the chests/item room issues. This depends largely on what is possible with the coding.

What I would consider the best solution would be to form a method to mule without having to switch characters. That way, no additional space is added to create lag, but characters have 4 characters worth of pack space.

To avoid creating an inventory 4x the standard size, this function can be restricted to certain areas, such as the player's house. There could be furthur restrictions on this if you want; such as, for example, that mule that you wish to access must also be in the same housing structure, or in a special "chest apparatus".

MeTaGarfield

03-06-2004, 07:58 PM

Most of it looks good, or in need for further informatin before I say something.

That said, I want to complain.

Yes, like most everyone else, it is about settlement portals.

While settlements may have crowded Dereth to a point where you cannot move anywhere on the main land without experiencing the lag spike from loading a settlement, this also has made all of Dereth accessible.

I don't think you will see any settlement gems sold at marketplace, they are not valuable enough. With trade health elixirs people who buy will buy by the hundreds, with gems, you only want one and what is it worth to get to that settlement? 1000 pyreal? 5000 pyreal? So the gem may be sold for 1000 at the settlement and 5000 in the marketplace, but how are you going to pay for it? Buying 8 for a plat is silly, you won't need that many, especially as you can go to the settlement and buy a few for the lower price anyway.

Move the settlement portals to the meeting halls of you want them out of the landscape.

The only problem I ever had with settlement portals is that there are too many at some places so it is hard to find the one you need.

At the very least put a gem seller in the corresponding town so you can get from the town to the settlement.

Pigroast

03-06-2004, 08:20 PM

the real reason for taking out the portals:

http://vnboards.ign.com/AC_Developers_Board/b5142/65406919/p1

Jack Aubrey

03-06-2004, 08:44 PM

Why not move or add some houses near the towns? I recall to my cottage in the middle of nowhere. Recalling to near a town would cause me to buy/sell in that town rather than recalling to the subway.

I am not keen on the change to dispell gems. To add disspell spells will make it hard for my debuffed melees to cast a 7. I do like the idea to stack them, but would rather have non-stacking gems that dumped all debuffs than limited debuffs. Like another poster, understanding the change does not mean I like it.

If you add spells, PLEASE make the system less random than sik chests. Either make the scrolls sold in by a vendor or some sort of predictable way to get the spells.

Settlement portals - I am ambivalent. One of AC's great advantages is the sheer size of the landscape. Unfortunately, much of it is not visited due to ease of portal transportation. Another reason though is that there is nothing in so much of the map worth hunting. I play mainly melee chars and the nice spread out spawns tend to drive me to dungeon hunting. Random "cool" features like landscape versions of jojii's fountain or some other bonus that does not unbalance things, but rewards wandering around would help get people from the same areas.

I would also suggest another room to the marketplace with a supersubway with portals to ALL towns. THis would more than make up for any inconvenience of losing settlement portals IMHO.

I like the possible loot changes. THe proof will be in the pudding though. Pure rnadom chance might drive people to hunt dungeons with fast spawns fo critters they can one hit in order to max their chance of pulling a rare item.

brucehreese

03-06-2004, 08:45 PM

I think a gem for each settlement is a bit much.( storage space is a problem now with most players). Most of the time the portal is only used to get a player near to where he really wants to be. And a list of off the settlements with coords, can be used in this regard, or a plug in that does the search for the player. Running there ahead of time for the gem, would only be fesible for a planned quest where many players are involved. I think a better option, would be to have gems that a player can buy in most towns that take them to the settlement portal hubs. Have the hub removed from the landscape, a separate place like the market is. Maybe individual settlement gems could be made exclusively by alchemists ( this would give more importance to the alchemist trade). Alchemists need more to do. The lev 6 gems that they were given to make really isnt used that much that I can see -- let them make lev 7 gems with item and creature -- now that will put an alchemist in demand.

Latty

03-06-2004, 10:24 PM

In regards to getting people back to the towns, why not just eliminate mansions completely? I used to like the fact that people thronged to towns (even with the lag and all) and I met many people this way that turned into awesome friends.

The Spectre

03-06-2004, 10:41 PM

There are several items seriously missing for concept ideas... Here they are:

1. Pets - C'mon, let us have a pet Reedshark, Golem, or any of the other "low intelligence" monsters.
2. New skills - Ok, a BIG portion of the player base is capped and cannot learn new skills. How about something like what you did in AC2? Some type of special XP or Hero abilities you can only get from certain monsters or quests, with new skills to go with it? (Maybe this is an expansion idea?)
3. Portal Changes - How about entirely new looks to the portals of differnet types? Color coding them by level is ok, but what about lightning effects or something for high level ones?
4. Player Appearance - Ok, we hae hands with opposable thumbs now, how about some more differentiation to the facial models, and sollerets that don't look like jester's shoes? :)
5. Knorr - Ok, when are we going to see some of those portals come open, since Asheron is off fighting the Olthoi? I want a new continent!!! (Expansion again, huh?)

Rivan II of WE

03-06-2004, 10:50 PM

Just had a read of the IGN thread and low and beholf Orion decided to come clean on this. It's got nothing to do with ugliness - the great GOD DEVS have decided we should not have used the Housing Portals as shortcuts. However I distinctly remember when they came in they said how much they would help us getting around.

It's plain dishonest to leave this feature in the game and never refer to it as an error and then remove it. Are you really trying to say Turbine that you never realised people would use them to get places easier? Sorry, I don't buy that either. You watched the sites like Dereth Navigation go up and never said a thing.

Everyone seems to have missed the basic point, not everyone knows where they want to go to when they log on. So what I have to do is run to the settlement and get a gem to the same settlement - duh! If I run to the settlement I won't need a gem to get there! Talk about reverse logic!

Well I am not ging to give up on my campaign - what we need is a poll!

Valith

03-07-2004, 01:04 AM

I want my Farking PEA's back.
I dont give a shoot about much elce right now but being able to afford to re stock comps and stam elixers.
you dev's that taken that from me. I can not with the existing loot values afford to hunt. FIX THIS RIGHT FARKING NOW. NOT IN MONTHS FROM NOW RIGHT FARKING NOW.

I have 3 accounts and pay my adiction fee's on time for years now and this is what I get as a reward beat to the head with the nerf bat.. Gawd I am so enraged.
I am not playing my people right now .. because I know if I spend 3-4 hours collecting lvl 3 scrolls and leather armor and every other kind of **** till my bu is so high I can barly move I still wont make enough py to pay my expences. I have had it I am so damn close to just closeing up my accounts. I will wait and see if this get's fixed with the next patch. if not I am gone. I will not stay around and pay you for farking up the game i love.

MIdnightFire7

03-07-2004, 11:04 AM

Well I am not ging to give up on my campaign - what we need is a poll!

I totally agree. They should give us a poll. I use settlement portals as shortcuts because I have an hour maybe two to play a night. If they get rid of them ill not get to do any quests. Ill just sit around at the mansion talking to players. There will be no need for me to try and do anything. It will not make me explore more. I will not explore at all. Removing them is the stupidest idea I’ve heard.

I want my Farking PEA's back.

Yeah what he said!

Nemesis-SC

03-07-2004, 12:23 PM

i too remember turbine saying how much more easier it will be to get around w/ the settlement portals. NEVER have i heard that they are too ugly. I've been playing for 3 yrs and content has always improved till you guys bought this back. Starting to feel like a pin cushion w/ all your "improvements" to the game. It seems that your pocketbook is gonna be severely effected if you "ibn" dont fix your ways. Basic econ. Have a good product. ppls will buy. This is turning into a real sour grape.

Eschient

03-07-2004, 12:57 PM

Wow, nice work! This is the kind of communication that we've come to love and expect from you guys! :)

Having said that, I like everything *except* the removal of settlement portals. I always looked to the settlement portals, especially on my low levs, for my hunting grounds. Whenever I was ready for a new challenge, I would run to the town settlement portals and hit them one by one until I found an area I was happy hunting in.

If the portals are so "ugly" {ha! When I started it was more like "oooh! Where do those go??"} then move them inside the useless old buildings that are pointlessly dotting the landscape. Then the Meeting halls would become a local form of sub. Or at the very least, make the portal gems for the local portals purchasable in town instead of at the settlement itself.

Rivan II of WE

03-07-2004, 01:16 PM

Well my dear Ibn and Devs - looks like I may just get my bandwagon rolling:) As you see not everyone has your luxury of playing games all day - some of us have jobs. For which we receive money; with which we pay your wages. Ready for a re-think on the portals yet?

Silifi Of Death

03-07-2004, 02:02 PM

...I luv you turbine

Melee mods of casting weapons is very nice. March changes give melees too much, thing balanced it out. Along with the changes to archers.. it's fixed. So, after that's done, DON'T CHANGE ANYTHING.

And, you're gonna make me rich! I have one of the most desirable houses in the world, so I can easily use this settlement gem thing to make tons of money, and organize hunts for my allegiance. Thank you!

Kayoss

03-07-2004, 05:22 PM

Thank you for the indepth info. This is GREAT.

I'm extremely thankful for allegiance account bans.

If you're looking to make more hookable items as "mansion improvements", please consider making them WALL hookable. Or increase floor hooks. Or add more hooks to the front of mansions. Most of AC's great items are floor hookable, and there simply aren't enough floor hooks.

I see more complaints about removing settlement portals than "atta boys". Consider moving the portals into another subway-like dungeon. Or simply put gems on archmages. Adding an npc to settlements will add an extra step for quest leaders and questers alike. In my opinion, removing the settlement portals is a step back in time, not forward.

Jet-eye-nite

03-07-2004, 05:46 PM

I wonder if all this concept is centered around only the newbies and the high lvls , as I see no conversation concerning the 50-100 lvl players on any topics here . I always wondered what the the numbers where per lvl ( like 4000 +126 , 2000 126,800 +100,250 100,175 -100 )and maybe that is why your only concern is content for the +126 crowd .I play solo and with all the changes I will "never" make it to 126 . I played an 80 char today and 1/2 thru buff cycle decided "pfft". I guess I just missed the boat on all the ways everyone else used to get to high lvl .

Bartz HG

03-07-2004, 05:55 PM

the idea of gettting rid of the settlement portals stinks.. if u want to clean up the look of settlement portals do something like leave the settlement monument and make it clikable or tieable and then drop to a dungeon like area with all portals to different settlements. something like the residential quarters. u could also thro in some shopkeepers in there to sell/buy stuff. i think transprtation wise many would appreciate something like that.

neuro

03-08-2004, 03:02 AM

In reguards to loot:
how about making the workmanship make sense, i.e. a craft 10 item is the best craft right, therefore it should suport the most tinks not the least. If I build something really well, I should be able to take it apart and expand on it easily versus a poorly crafted item that will probably fall apart on me. (Quick Fix, invert the craft table labels)

Increase pyreal stacks 10k is a joke now. a 20k stack would even be an improvement

Removed the damn barriers on DT. Any type of guild duealing mansion/villa, no barrier. Housing/Appartments are ok.

Web:
See the dying PK Hunter and TreeStats websites for starters. And for a PK score, have deaths subtract points. We're interested in skillful players (the ones that don't die) not just the ones that kill all day.

Other:

Removed the respec/change attributes quests, now that xp chains are gone. Make everyone reroll and relevel or deal with their template they chose. This will add playtime to the game as well as fill up those character slots, which brings you more money. Everyone will hate it because the best template changes every month but that's good, everyone gets a month or two of having the best template.

Spell Research, AMG, this was the coolest thing about AC back in the day. ADD IT BACK. Randomize tapers per character, no formulas. I know this will increase the data storage requirement, but I think it was a bad ass element to the game. Back in the day that got cracked and it got thrown away. Make store scrolls more expensive relative to the cost of figure out x number of random tapers. You have the interface/engine for this already done, it can't be too much work.

Leelando

03-08-2004, 10:50 AM

Ok, this is my first post so I feel quite strongly about some of these changes to our Game!!!

First, please stop making this game like AC2 in its play and dumbing it down for the masses.

Crafting in towns - Hmmmm, major thing in AC2. Forges in Towns, now remind me again why I didn't want to go play AC2. Oh, yeah, I didn't want to, so why are you going to make AC1 into another version of AC2.

Group Buffs - great for quests. AC2ish, but overall OK.

Dispell Gems - leave them alone, as long as your not PK(L)ing. If your choice is PvP then yes make them less powerful and random number dispells, but I like others use them sparingly and only when really needed for those chain casting Spawns. There has got to be some way to code this stuff, that it reacts differently if you are PK(L).

Housing Portals - Leave them alone, I like others want to spend my few minutes or hours hunting critters, not running all over the landscape just to have a few minutes left to hunt. Don't make this game like EQ where it is run everywhere you want to go.

Buffing Changes – About time, however most of my spells are made up of banes and this will not help it in the immediate future, but I am glad that you all are at the least taking a look at fixing the huge amount of time spent buffing.

These ramblings are just my 2 pyreals worth so other than that I think the changes that are coming down sound great.

Suki

03-08-2004, 11:23 AM

HOUSING PORTALS:

While the reason may well be that turbine feels we should work harder... there are some things to consider.

1. With the allegiance changes, smaller monarchies are becoming more viable. The draw for chains is not there. HOWEVER smaller monarchies have a hard time running quests due to player availability. The last thing they want is making getting to a quest spot harder.

2. Folks play for fun and enjoyment, and not many have the hours to play that I do *I am cursed*. I know there are many folks that won't quest much if they have to go back to running for hours.

3. I guess I don't understand what majority of players said it was too easy. This is a game and like many have said before me Game = Fun. We are playing to have Fun. Why make it harder if we haven't asked for it?

4. If these gems are to transport one individual only, where are we gonna store these? Many folks have already cancelled mule accounts due to the price increase. Will these gems stack?

This past month, with the loot tweekled, our group has quested a lot more and found a lot of joy in it.... if navigation is squirtled too, we will be even more unhappy than we were with the loot changes.

MANY folks have offered an alternative.. PLEASE sell the gems in the towns that were closest to the settlement portals themselves. This is fair middleground. Of course I would also like to see them summon a portal instead of transport one person.. hope I am not asking for too much :)

jaclin

03-08-2004, 01:13 PM

I agree with Suki in that you should have then summon the portal instead. If the portal is summonable then my mules would not have to have a portal too every settlement on hand to run quests. And BTW gems will make life ALLOT easier for people to get housing. It would be fairly easy to create a macro to click on the right portal gem then buy a villa. Granted it would only be once a month, but when the one villa pays for 5 accounts for a month, I guess you can just buy allot more accounts.

My first instinct is to put them in the halls in the towns so they are out of sight and no longer ugly. If you have to remove them please make the gems summonable. And worse thing is at least be able to buy the gems in towns instead of in the settlements.

Mcygee

03-08-2004, 01:28 PM

Looks goood, though I still think it's more important to give the character classes more ways of attack. Iike two handed weapons, attacks that hit multiple enemies, dual wield, things like that. We hunt to level, which takes up the majority of our in game time, it only makes sense that this is one of the areas that needs most improved.

Though I suppose this is only a dream. Hopefully Turbine will concider this one day, and see how important it really is.

crimson_knight

03-08-2004, 03:53 PM

the only thing i do not like is the removal of settlement portals and buying the gems at the settlement

i think a vendor in town would be alot better

heck put him in the basement of the arcane agent

and make the gems hookable so you can use them over and over
hey thats a way to make mansions more valuable make the hookable gems mansion dungeon only

_DOT_1_2_3_4_5_

03-08-2004, 04:17 PM

will try this again grr do not know why it is so hard to post comments when registered <sigh>

ok .. like most of the new ideas but hate the idea of losing settlement portals. I solo alot and use this method of transportation not only for questing but for exploring new areas. I am a pack rat and have no room for more gems and have no desire to buy "a pig in a poke" to look around but do frequently pop into a new area to explore. I have been playing the game since before the advent of these portals and can tell you I have explored more and tried more areas because of them. If you find them unsightly, which I do not, then do as others have suggested - put them in the town halls.

Thank you so much for this method of communicating before something is a done deal... at least we get our 2 pyreals in.

Ibn

03-08-2004, 06:52 PM

Just wanted to say thanks for all the great feedback in this thread. Having this level of communication while these concepts are being worked on is proving to be very valuable.

Regarding the settlement portal issue, which appears to be one of the real hot-button topics, I should be able to post an alternate suggestion sometime later this week.

Larytia

03-08-2004, 09:02 PM

Thanks again for the valuable info Ibn, I already replied to the development post.

Rares - Yes!!!! Great idea, look forward to this.

Web Integration - Another great idea. I hope that you plan on making quite a bit of info available through the web. I'm hoping for something similar, but better to AO's web info for characters. Also please put this into XML format so it's usable.

Content Revisions, Better Weapons, New Loot Armor, Further Buffing Improvements, Missile Attack Improvements, Town Improvements, Allegiance Improvements, Mansion Improvements are all good ideas.

PvP Changes - The only thing I have to say about this, please don't make NPKs suffer for PK issues again. The whole "you've jumped too recently" and the movement cancelling healing and casting was ridiculous for us NPKs. I have nothing but respect for PKers, but their issues shouldn't negatively affect our gameplay. And I'm sure that most mature PKers would agree with me.

Larytia Al-Qaqa
TSC/Leafcull

TTF

03-08-2004, 11:46 PM

w00t Great to hear Ibn!! :D Ya, a lot of us are really concerned about the travel options....airports are bad enough these days. One of the biggest downfalls of another mmorpg, not to name names, was waiting 9:59 minutes for a shuttleride from, oh lets say 'mos tequilia' to 'anchorfoot' (names changed to preserve anonymity) :cool:

Horkaw

03-09-2004, 12:34 AM

Removing Housing Portals:

Not the best idea to come down the pike. Issuiing Gems is another ...........what the?..........

Pack space becomes a premium and adding another change which will force people to store Gems for usage later on is one concept I hope dies on the vine.

Other then that, great job and keep up the great work!!

StarchaserX

03-09-2004, 03:02 AM

Someone had posted on vnboards that they thought Mansions had also contributed to the death of towns.

Here is a possible suggestion:

Re-locate mansions to towns, towns also receiving a *random*
crafting bonus, would do much for bringing people back into towns.

To be fair, it would have to be drawn by lottery, and any mansion
in the dires, would probably have to receive a much lesser desired crafting bonus as the main perk is that the mansion is in the dires.

To reduce the possibility of abuse, perhaps the crafting bonus would be allegiance specific and would be tied to time sworn, or
maybe a rent a bonus: donation of sing/notes/peas/salvage, etc.
to the crafting house to receive the bonus. And bonus would be tied to and/or amount of salvage donated/Workmanship of salvage.

If you want a weapon bonus, donate weapon tinkering salvage, etc.

Maybe you have a very uber max damage/varience/mod weapon
with majors/self-buffing whatever but it's W9 that will go at most,
6 times. With a hefty donation of Weapon tinkering salvage, it would make it possible to go all 10.

By hefty donation, say, each donated bag will add 1% or +1 point
to skill. So you save a month for your chance and donate 100 bags of weapon salvage and receive either a 100% to skill, effectively doubling it or +100 points to skill.

Either way, it provides as a sink for salvage otherwise not often used, stimulates the economy as some people would rather trade for salvage than hunt it, and lastly, it should not be a bonus used frivolously(sp?), crafting house bonuses should be a big deal.

For the finishing tinkers on -W5 items, and you want to *really*
protect your investment.

On higher work items when you just will not be happy unless you
*go for it*.

And lastly, make it expensive enough so that Master Tinkers will not be tempted to crank out 10x items on a constant basis.

Excaliber was very special for a reason: there was only one.

StarchaserX

03-09-2004, 03:19 AM

There should probably always be a base bonus that everyone has access to.

But for the really tough tinkers beyond the norm, if this donation idea were to be done, is that there must be a way to connect the salvage donated to a single item to be tinkered.

Say I donate 100 bags of armor salvage for a 100% to skill.
To prevent me from cranking out as many 10x tinked items as possible during the time allotted, those 100 bags should be tied in someway to the tinkering of one single item. As it would represent the acme of my skill/devotion/whatever towards it's crafting.

Akin to an old world craftsman that devotes his life to not the mass production of goods, but by the individual creation of masterpieces, few in number due to the resources of time/energy that has been devoted.

There is only one Sistine Chapel, no?

Nightmare-HG

03-09-2004, 09:22 AM

Fantastic information, the best I've seen while playing AC (3 years). I hope to post comments on both 'In Development' and 'In Concept'.

I hope though, that these are plausible suggestions you've made and not 'hookable portal' style ideas which sound great but are never going to happen...

Anyway, point by point:

Content Revisions
Even as long ago as when I started playing AC some of the quests I did were out of date, the rewards unhelpful. The work so far to update the games content as well as add new content is more than welcome.

I hope that in time as well as providing helpful items to AC's new players older revised content will be a fun thing for us old timers to run through and reminisce about.

Better Weapons
I'm all for more choice of weapons, more variety, but I don't see much point increasing the power of weapons any further unless in turn that leads to higher level content.

Giving us even better weapons to fight current critters would just dumb things down IMHO.

New Loot Armor
Same view here as weapons, more interesting is good, more AL is bad :)

From the PvP chat you mentioned that the effect of debuffable armor would be offset by higher base AL (or at least that's how I took it). I was wondering what the point of this was overall, do you see debuffable armor as an increasing the strategic element of the game?

Rares
This sounds like a very interesting idea, as long as they were really cool enough :) They would have to have unique properties (at least unique to the class) and perhaps a certain visual style?

The only problem I see with this is what you've mentioned about having the same chance of finding them across all critters. I can see this leading to a camping/UCM problem of low level critters...I would certainly rather kill a great number of very easy critters than risk Duking it out with the tough guys for the same low low chance of a drop.

Of course the plus side of this system is that low level players could find items of use to anyone, for sale or trade.

Further Buffing Improvements
Can't wait to hear more about this, the level 1 casting time is a simple and effective but fellowship buffs, multi skill buffs and buff profiles would be better...I look forward to the article!

Missile Attack Improvements
Recalibrating the accuracy/speed slider.
Interesting idea, perhaps making the high levels of (bow) skill more meaningful would be a fairer and more rewarding way of looking at this, and more in keeping with the ideas behind AC's skill system.
A new pathing type for missile attacks.
Why not! A streak style attack would make sense, you pull your bow back very hard and you get a fast moving arrow and an almost 'flat' trajectory.

Town Improvements
Anything to get people back in the towns, I miss that :( The PvP dynamic sounds interesting but runs the risk of causing big lag and putting everyone but the PK's off even more. Crafting bonus would only drag mules and they are often more helpful at mansions where everyone can reach them and use their skills.

Perhaps something regarding transport would be good if you insist on removing housing portals (yuck to that idea). Enhance the portal loops, or add portals to meeting halls or something along those lines.

Allegiance Improvements
These sound like a lot of fun and maybe a way to get people more involved, and perhaps even give them goals to achieve within the allegiance. For instance, a system where a certain number of positive 'votes' from fellow guild members would elevate your title in some way...just an idea.

Mansion Improvements
IMHO hookable items are not an improvement. I think I've done about 1 of these quests, and the reason for this is that I only use my villa for storage. People only use mansions for meeting and buff bots. I hardly ever see anyone inside at all. Again perhaps some sort of solution to the transport/towns problem could be addressed here, not sure how...hookable portals? (haha) or maybe a vendor with free gems to towns in there somewhere? The vendor would have his tag as Monarch: (mansion owner). To be honest I dislike the Gem idea from a pack space perspective but if you guys want to run with it I may as well think of an idea for it ;)

PvP Changes
I don't PvP enough to make an informed suggestion about this, apart from to say that I wish my level 115 UA didn't get totally and utterly owned by any mage that can cast VII's (read lvl 70+)

Web Integration
Integrated Treestats! I like it! Could the in game Lore panel be overhauled to take live content from the Turbine site perhaps?

Anyway, that’s all for now, I appreciate anyone that takes the time to read it all!

Rivan II of WE

03-09-2004, 12:35 PM

Thumbs up for listening to us Ibn on the Housing Settlement Portals front - we can't ask more than that for now.

Dr. McNasty

03-09-2004, 12:49 PM

These are some great ideas. I'm very excited to see the tinker calculation changes coming this month. Also, I especially like the faster self buffs. I have been pushing for that for a while.

I'm very excited about the way things are taking shape. I think that the increased and more interactive communication is going to be a huge key to keeping this game great. This is one of the few announcements that has let the players know that you guys are not only familier with the players concerns, but that you have plans in the future of making changes as well. I think it is a huge step in the right direction. The open communication definately cuts down on the frustration of the players. It almost makes up for what you did to the XP. (had to throw that in)

Keep up the good work guys(and girls). I look forward to seeing what you come up with next.

Tesuji Aji

03-09-2004, 01:12 PM

Nerfing the bows %, so you can bring us back the same weapons later as an Improvement is bogus.

I think that the dispell gem nerf makes solo'ing less viable. I think the fellow spells is more lets force everyone to group. I dont mind the idea of crafting bonuses, but if you are going to force people to go PK or PKL to get them... What is the point? Most the PK's and PKL's are playing a completly diffrent type of game than the CareBears. From the CareBear view the PK/PKL's are trash talking twits. Turbine has done nothing to police them, and it is too late to change them.

None of your proposed changes will allow trade skill mules to play with out becoming warrior/mages. I would like to see that change. Ibn's estimate that there are plenty of ways to lvl a char w/o fighting, (Gambeling, turn in items, and Toothpaste ????) I belive is seriously inaccurate if you would like to lvl a trade skills char to 126.

Many of the proposed changes are the AC2 interface and game play - most of us hated over there, and decided to stay in AC instead. Is your goal to force us to AC2 or quit playing turbine games?

knopp

03-09-2004, 01:33 PM

Why is it that I spend more time on the message boards hoping that AC will become a good game again then I do logged in?

When you answer that truthfully, you will finally understand.

lrn2glf

03-09-2004, 05:22 PM

As a user of AC for a little over 9 months, I have seen a great amount of changes in such a short time. The most troubling is the break down of allegiances. I greatly enjoyed recalling to the mansion and interacting with a mob of people. Bots were the greatest reason to come to a mansion. If you place benefits for tinkering in towns, that would move more people to towns and away from mansions. This being said, I have an idea for you to consider.

Mansions have many rooms. What if you were to place mini storage containers in a percentage of the rooms that allowed for unique user identification. Then the monarch could assign rights to a chest to a vassal and that would give more reason for a non apt/housing owner to come to the mansion.

Just an idea of how to keep traffic coming to mansions as well as towns.

Spike Lady

03-09-2004, 06:10 PM

Here is a suggestion to make the settlement portals still viable, but less obtrusive on the enviornment.

You could put a SINGLE portal where they are now and that would portal you into an area like the bottom of sub (or like apt types) so that you can then use them to get to other destinations. It would be one more portal hop, but still viable and not taking up the space on the planet surface.

Cuttler

03-09-2004, 10:33 PM

Spike Lady, "the portals being ulgy" is an outright LIE on turbine's part. Orion confirmed that on the Vault: http://vnboards.ign.com/message.asp?topic=65406919&start=65415594

They don't care that we are unhappy about this change any more than the outcry of all the other changes they have reciently implemented or are planning to implement.

Digero

03-10-2004, 02:05 AM

*cough* (http://forums.ac.turbinegames.com/showthread.php?&postid=46998#post46998)

Funky BM

03-10-2004, 09:04 AM

I like what is proposed. The big picture looks a lot better.

Kestrel

03-10-2004, 09:31 AM

Once we finish the billing transition, currently scheduled for this summer, we can begin looking at tying the Asheron’s Call website more tightly to the game. Some of the features we are considering include a single login to both the game and the forums, the ability to view your character or allegiance statistics on the web, and ranking or ladder systems.

Yes yes yes yes yes yes yes!

Evil Bert

03-10-2004, 10:03 AM

I am still at a loss for the reason to remove these portals.

Because the make getting around Dereth easier
Ok. One of the big reasons I like this game so much is the fact that I don't spend countless hours of running. You don't explore when you are running to a quest. If you think that this is going to promote "exploring" you are out of your mind. When you are doing a quest you are focused on getting there and getting the quest done. If I want to explore, and I often do, I hit a portal and take off and see where it takes me or what I can find. This whole idea of the portals being ugly is crazy. If you are worried abou thow things look then worry about upgrading the graphics engine as a whole. That is not a valid reason to make this change. I know Turbine is trying to make this game harder. It probably needs it. But don't do it by forcing us to waste time running across vast lands experiencing lag from the servers populating the areas. I have a few hours a night to play the game. I DO NOT want to spend the majority of it running just to get to a dungeon or hunting grounds. I understand that you guys are trying to circumvent the ease of accessibility, but in the long run you are severly hurting the casual player making most of the content not accessible due to time restraints of the player. It just doesn't make sense to me.

Please, please keep in mind the casual gamer as well has the addicts. You can't make changes to solve a problem in one area and make numerous problems in another.

Make an settlement obelisk or something that takes you to a housing portal hub. This solves your "ugly" problem but doesn't hurt the accessibility of the areas of Dereth. The Gem idea is bad. Again hurting the casual player. Keep in mind, the casual player pays as much as the addicts do.

If you do not want to use the portals to get to places, then don't. It is as easy as that. But don't take away our options and force us to do things the way you want us to do them. Well I guess we already do that now don't we.

mopweilder

03-10-2004, 02:01 PM

I just wanted to say how refreshing it is to feel like you are being kept in touch with where your game is going. This is a big positive for this game and Turbine.
I love the housing ideas, I like the marketplace ideas, but let's not stop there, can we not have the hallways clear of bots as well? Why not have tent awnings storefront fixtures something like that. Perhaps maybe even a Positive feedback icon like on ebay heh heh. I will accept the changes to the Gems of Stillness, but I agree stacking would make them easier to accept. Any thoughts for those of us that are lone wolves (in game)? I would like to see Solo Quest items, that you would receive for going it alone for certain quests. Towns need to be rehabbed and I am happy to see you are doing this. Entertainment never hurts, Casinos in towns might work. Lastly an idea I had way back when I lost track of some friends and could only log on intermittently, how about mailboxes for our homes? Would give a whole new reason for parchment, and besides could create a new underground economy for junk mail.

Eph

03-10-2004, 07:56 PM

First off - Standing ovations are warranted!!!

Things I like to remark on. Ideas, Likes, & Dislikes

Settlement Portals - Create one portal to a chamber with the Settlement Portals in them. (mini hubs) Fewer portals on surface, no gems to stock pile for Villa Hunters.

Vendor Buy-Sell Rates - Provide new towns with no Lifestone or Portal Recall ability. Place them in locations not easy to reach, and areas of high-level monsters. Both of these would prevent macros and the ability of low-level characters from completing the trips. Certain items would sell high, while others sell low. Same would go for buying. (i.e. Desert town buys and sells water at a higher price, yet sells Sand at a lower price. Sand is used for crafting new glass items in game) Content other than just adding routes for merchant caravans can be used.

Dispel Revisions - Level VII dispel spells are needed for PK environment, yet melees would need an equalizer at the same time. Mages would be undoubtedly become all powerful in PK if not. Spells need high difficulty, lengthy casting time, and high mana usage, possibly no mana conversion adjustment.

Buffing Improvements - Buffing is fine as for buffing a person. However, multiple buffing on an item, such as a piece of armor or weapon would be great, or allow multiple items to be buffed at once.

Treasure Changes, Phase 3 - personally I like what you have done, and I don't have a problem making ends meat.

Second-class” Weapons Get Upgrades - Possibly a combination of raising min damage, max damage, modifiers, speed. Maybe add special attacks for weapons that use up high amounts of Health, Stamina, or Mana per use. Something like this mace/smite, dagger/sneak attack, staff/bash, axe/cleave, spear/impale, sword/slice. Each would have different functions, and even could be tied into quests that certain bosses could only be killed by certain special attack.

Example: Special attacks could have a 33%-50% max success rate depending on Skill and Melee D of target, and drop Stamina and Mana to 0 while reducing Health to 1/3 of current value. Having no Stamina and Mana, while being at low life brings risk to being in combat. Can't heal; can't cast, and taking more damage for being exhausted. This would lead to more combination of support characters in fellows.

Fellowship Spells - Great Idea! Would love to see group heals, brings to an adventuring group the aspect of obtaining a mage with out War.

Envoy Policy Changes - I have my PPGSC that I lent to a friend, he inscribed the breastplate, turned over the armor to another friend of mine, and quit game with out uninscribing it. I have been stuck with it ever since, would love to have it uninscribed.

Rares - Great idea, not over powering, yet not useless.

Town Improvements - The ability for people to manage a town, and improve certain things, even to the point of changing the environment, while others can hinder you is very enticing. Making towns the sites of battles would be interesting, holding out in Shoushi behind its walls, fighting tooth and nail in Lin's deep narrow valley, fending off the high ground in Kara, or making a last stand on Rithwic's bridge. Towns could become PKlite zones by performing a certain set of actions within the town and stay PKlite for an hour or two while a raid could be conducted. The amount of times a town could become a PKlite zone could be limited to once a day, or more if the town was heavily traveled.

One other thing
Mages Rule the World - Ok, I play a mage, but would like to see more melee love. Create unbuffable weapons that inflict nice damage to characters that do not have Melee D trained or specialized, regardless of Life Pro's, Armor, or Banes. Also, give Missile D the ability to avoid most War spells, maybe a max of 33%-50%, that would allow melee to approach a mage after he/she casts level VII dispels then vulns.

Once again, I have to compliment you all on the new spark of life I see in this game again. I look forward to the Glory days of AC ahead of us.

Thank You

EDIT: grammar

Jet-eye-nite

03-10-2004, 10:57 PM

I wonder when you are going to pimp out an area for the 70-100 crowd.And no your extreme 80 isn't it(there isn't much there but lame golems) . I mean you made VoD for the uppies and then Caul ,what about us in the middle ? All the great loot now is for the uppies only and that just plain suxs :p

BlackOrdun

03-12-2004, 04:13 PM

After logging in for a bit and actually seeing the bunny in the circle, I got to thinking.

Remember the patch many moons ago that introduced <wait for it> baby bunnies???

One of the best bugs ever in the history of Dereth, was that if you killed a bunny that month - you'd be swarmed by all the rabbits in what seemed to be a 5 klick area.

I laughed so hard the first time I killed one looking for oregano my family thought I'd have a heart attack.

Ibn, Srand, Scenario, Orion - for me if no-one else:

Bring back the swarming daemon bunnies! :D:D:rolleyes:

Now that's a concept!:cool:

Black Ordun

oerly

03-12-2004, 05:30 PM

Web Integration and billing:

I play ac for 2 years now and still almost each time I log in to
play I am thinking man what a crappy login procedure.

open ac icon from desktop
click play ac
click sign In
enter username,password
click logon
click yes warning 1 leaving trusted area
click yes warning 2 another trusted connection warning
click select a world to play in
close the zone friends window in the taskbaricon
click play
click 2 times to bypass the splash screens

thats it .:confused: now I can select a char and play.

I am looking forward to see improvements here.

torak101

03-14-2004, 10:53 AM

AC is doing a fantastic job at breathing some new life into an "old" classic!
I like your new developement and concept articles.
Heres some feedback, for what its worth....

Content revisions
The interesting thing about on-line games is that they are always in a state of change. One months uber quest is next months old news. I think quest items should have some sort of special property or combination of abilities that can not be reproduce anywhere. Otherwise it just turns into an arms race for the highest damage output. Many of the items you listed are very good items, however as the average character level increases, lower level quest have less appeal. Why not scale the quest like the newer Rainment quest? The item would be scaled according to level. That would make all quest valuable to all level ranges.
With the coming work on AC, I guessing that you plan on drawing a bunch of new players. Nothing can be more discouraging then being lost and confused in a game that caters to high level players. You could easily pick up new players looking to try something new or return to something old and just as easily loose them.

Rares
Again, rares should have something unique about them. Something that makes them stand out and not easily replaced or outdated.

Buff Improvements
I think that making group/fellow buffs will help define the mages in AC as far as group roles are concerned. I never liked the idea of being some sort of 3 school melee was the only way to be viable. I would rather spend the extra 10 min looking for a mage to fellow with and let them worry about the casting stuff and me worry about bashin bugs.

Better weapons
Why better? how about different. How about 2 handed weapons. I realise this would require animation coding but if you are gonna do it, do something new. Adding more damage isnt the answer. A big mean 2 handed sword or axe is! (with more damage lol) Maybe add the skill 2 handed weapons

Town Improvements
Now heres a can of worms that was made. The only way to improve towns is to give the players a reason to go to them. Sale rates are a start however, why do you need to go to a town to sell off then transport to a seperate marketplace to do business?
Get rid of the marketplace as it stands now.
Give each town a marketplace (outdoors in the town) stalls and all. If possible make them recallable (/marketplace holtburg for example) There you go towns just about fixed.
Next put a big crafting building or spot in the town. A blacksmith area for tinking (+something to skill) An alchemy table and such for other skills. Imagine going to an arrow merchant shop and finding an NPC and a player crafter making arrows and selling them. (the crafter using a unique bonus tool in the shop)
The stalls will make a good place for the trade bots to be throughout the world rather then just crammed into one room.
If you plan on making towns something to fight over, well you are gonna need something worth fighting over. I would not waste my time fighting for control of some empty buildings with only npcs merchants in them.

Alliance chat
First thing I noticed when I returned to AC was how basic and clumsy the chat system is. We need a chat window that is not taken up with combat spam, please split the screen.
A way to see who in the alliance is on would be nice also, a /who command. Its awakward asking hello who is on.
A rank/title system would be nice also.
Naming monarchies, I thought a long time ago you could name them??? I remember looking at the names of them on the characters. (the Knights of Ni comes to mind right away)

Web intregration
Would be nice, but to what end? If for a PvP latter that would be cool.

Other notes/suggestions

PvP
Stealth. Need it. that radar screen totally robs the PvP from AC. Play another on-line PvP game and see the difference actually having to look for you enemy makes. Heart pounding fun!

Mounts
Since the housing portals will be gone, we will need a way to get around (wink wink)

New races
How about a playable Lugian or Tumerok? You can do it in AC2 why not AC? The creatures are there, just need to make them playable I would think.

New faces/hair styles
Kinda bland in todays market guys, need a new look.

Phew,
Thanks again for all the hard work you are doing! I hope I gave something of value.

Silifi Of Death

03-14-2004, 11:09 AM

When you see the name of the allegiance, that's because those people made a character named "Knights of Ni" instead of using a regular character as monarch.

Cuttler

03-14-2004, 11:33 AM

I'm not intrested in split chat screens (did that in SWG, didn't like it), or mounts (just one more thing to lag the game). Not intrested in playing or fighting player controlled lugians or tumeroks. Those are in AC2 and they should stay there.

This game has survived for 4+ years for a reason. Messing with how it works and is run needs to stop before it is distroyed.

knopp

03-16-2004, 12:10 AM

I know I've been harsh on these boards about a few things and about a few people, but to be honest, if I didn't love AC as much as I do, I wouldn't care at all.

Now with that said, how about an idea, :-)

What about a new 33% Imbue that would add multi strike to ANY weapon?

Before you start screaming about balance issues, remember that if this was added, you wouldnt be able to imbue with any rends/ar/cb/cs.

Even allow it for bows/xbows. That way you shoot, shoot again and up the DOT, but you would still have to vuln the monster first to do any serious damage.

I might actually play my axer again if this was done. The only thing that would reall yhave to be added to teh game would be the animation for a "backhand" swing instead of teh cheesy quick poke of the dagger/rapier multistrike.

To be honest, this may be in the game already. I have never seen a hilted yaoji in action before.

I think if the devs seriously consudered this, it would add a whole new dynamic to the game and give more melee choices than just sword.

Any comments/flames welcome...:-)

Totaldefiance

03-17-2004, 10:53 AM

Excellent idea guys. Talking to the players before you make changes is brilliant.

Concerning your ideas, here are my humble thoughts.

-Better Weapons via new properties is a good idea. It will help expand on the current weapon lineup without unbalancing it by very much

-As for new armor, All it comes down to is max armor level and number of pieces. People like Celedon because it has higher AL, but mages adore amuli because its quicker to buff. I dont know if you guys know that or not, but try and take it into consideration if you make new armor

-"Rare" items sound like a nice twist, as long as thier balanced like you say they will be.

-Your new buffing Idea is freaken awsome. Quicker self buffs but normal other buffs to discourage buff bots. It goes to show that you guys know how to make the game more fun.

-Missle trajectory change is a good idea, but I wonder what will happen if you make it at the expense of a new ammunition. Archers are over burdened as as, so a new type of ammo might not be the best idea. A button on the combat bar is however...

-Capture and hold towns? Sounds like plenty of PK and PKL fun. Im worried about the lag caused in places like Ayan Baqur though. Maybe you guys can come up with a precaution against that? Like timers against going PK or PKL in a town or surrounding area?

-As for settlement portals, maybe your all thinking wierd here, but why not make an NPC that just teleports you to the settlement area. Just pay him and he sells a teleport? Dont bother with gems, or hubs. just make it so that when you pay him on his drop down mewnu for something, he just casts a spell on you and off you go!

Anyway, those are just my thoughts. Thanks for your time.:) :)

Ashida Kim

03-17-2004, 01:07 PM

My hat off to you guys for promoting a new and better form of communication. I will be looking foward to these articles almost as much as the content on patch day.

Just a few comments about the items in consideration:

1) PK's having somethign worth fighting for in towns. I think this is a great idea, but I might suggest having the item that determines control in it's own area to reduce lag. IE: Maybe a seperate portal like the town arenas. You would deffinately want it to be something other than a large room. Preferrably something with obsticles, multi-tiered, choke points, etc so that tactics can come into play.

2) Rare's. I gathered from what I read that each of these items will eb something that would be useful to anyone, or almost anyone, maybe partially based off of skill set. What I am invisioning are things such as:

A quiver that takes the place of a pack but can hold larger stacks of ammo or fletching supplies, but which reduces the burden of said items in pack.

For that matter, you could even just have packs that reduce the burden on anything that is put in them.

Trade skill kits: something that would give a bonus to your trade skills checks or gives a small chance to get a second use out of ingredients. Maybe not even a kit, maybe individual items, such as a peerless inticate carving tool, measused eye dropper, oversized baking pan, etc.

A wallet for holding all of your trade notes: No limit on number of trade notes it can hold, but only takes up one pack space. Once you put trade notes in it, you can pull then back out in any interval. For example, I put an MMD into it, but take out a D note to pay this vendor, leaving the balance of an MM in the wallet.

Maybe items such as talismans that, when held in your inventory, reduce the rate at which your mana burns in items.

Advanced Foci that work like a pack but can only hold casting materials.

Mana stones that could hold up to 50k mana, and are not destroyed until empty.

Casting devices that come with no spell, but that you could add a single gem to, allowing the gem to be reused as if the casting device had come with that spell. (Portal gems : mmmm)

A charm that, as long as it is in your inventory, allows you to lose 1 less item when you die.

A healing kit with a much smaller number of uses (5 or 10 maybe) but that is 100% effective, even for characters without the skill and heals you fully.

Just a few ideas for you to think about :) Could we possibly get a thread for just player suggestions for rare drops to help give you guys some more ideas to consider?

poisontouch

03-17-2004, 03:10 PM

I would like to see turbine raise the 126 cap. So many people now are 126 and that drives them out of the game. It use to wow look a 126, he must be good. Now it is o another 126 that used a xp chain. It should be moved up to 200 or 250 that would insipre more people to hunt and try to lvl

Phosphine

03-18-2004, 10:37 AM

Dispel Revisions:
I suggest that the availability of dispel magic spells at all levels be adjusted. First, dispel magic scrolls are way too rare and you only have a 1 in 6 chance of getting the scroll you want. Outside of Ulgrim's Scroll, they are the rarest drop in the game. The first to third level ones should be available for purchase or by quest. No one ever uses them anyway. Fourth and fifth should spawn as scrolls one level higher. Sixth and seventh level scrolls should spawn in both SIK and Singularity chests. Second, they should not dispel a helpful spell, especially one you cast, unless you specifically flag the spell to do it. If we had spell research, this would be a component change. Dispelling your own magic is a huge issue unless you are buffed with a higher level of spells than the one you are trying to cast. Current casters should not be penalized for having found a very rare item and now have to get essentially a similar item all over again if and when this changes. Please keep the number of spells dispelled the same, its just right.

Dispel potions:
I like the idea of removing the two lowest levels of dispel potions. At least remove the lowest level one. The current way to make chorizite dispel potions is very unwieldy; you get one dispel 6 potion for all the mined chorizite. No one I know uses them for that reason. I suggest that after the chorizte oil is made, that it can be used to make an infusion. Combined with an alchemical base, it could be used on food or in elixirs. Having an alchemist make a substance usuable by both cooks and alchemists would match the current game mechanics. One batch of chorizite would make either 25 or 50 applications, success dependant upon the skill of the alchemist. You could even grade the ore, either needing one ore batch for each level or require a low, middle, or high grade of chorizite slag. For example, with the former and removing the bottom 2 dispel potion levels, to make a dispel 6 concentrated oil would require 8 ore batches to get either 25 or 50 applications. To get a dispel 7, would require 16. This would work well as a defacto allegiance quest but would allow independants to accomplish the same with lots more time without making it an allegiance or fellowship quest. Alternately, 3 and 4 dispel potions would require low grade, 5 and 6 medium grade, and 7 high grade chorizite ore. This would be faster and easier for the players.

Dispel gems:
I like the idea of dispel gems removing a random number of spells. If you do this, then I think they should be stackable, potions should have a narrower variance (3 –5 spells?) and be stackable as well.

Secourir

03-18-2004, 02:06 PM

I'm loving the mansion and allegiance concepts. When people ask what guild we're in it's hard to decide to tell them "Union of Friends" or just give our monarch's name. Also the titles are a great idea too. We more or less built our monarchy on a co-monarch kind of thinking. April' was just the one we decided to place at the top of it all. (She was and always will be my patron, so who better for the monarch. :p Just so happens her husband agreed with me on it. ;) ) Would be very nice to have a co-monarchs and titles for older members of the guild that have been with us since the start...like Clan Elder or something. Lovin' it!

As far as the settlement portals go...are you trying to confuse me. :D j/k I would go for gem vendors in the Towns and Settlements or say moving them to the meeting hall. The meeting halls rarely get used anymore. Maybe this would bring interest to them once again. Be nice to have like an NPC or vendor of some in the halls also. (Maybe the gem vendor can go there.) ;)

You guys rock...glad the game is back home. Too bad the Zone can't get it together like you guys can. After a week of login difficulties I'm rather :mad: !

Edit: Oops forgot to mention the dispell gems...STACKABLE PLEASE! I collect the gems for the guild and tend to give out like 24 gems at a time. So needless to say I have two mules with nearly nothing but gems. :( That's alot of wasted pack space, but those gems are great for the lower levels that join the higher level toon on tougher quests. Stacks of any amount would help. :)

Edit #2: Grr! I should have wrote this out first, lol. I keep forgetting topics. Housing timers is an awesome idea. All too often someone has bought a house, cleaned it out, then turn around and bought thier old house back. In the mean time we're left running back and forth. :eek: Gets annoying.

Tenzin

03-19-2004, 04:07 AM

Afros. An afro quest. I would like to give an old or new charactecter the ability to wear an afro hair style.

Tenzin

Daveda

03-19-2004, 09:27 PM

Eliminating Housing Portals is a bad idea. It is used for transports to quests... running is long a boring.

On items magic... banes in particular. It would be nice for self buffing if you could case a bane all on anything that you have on. It would cut down on baining before hunting and perhaps not damage the PVP balance.

I like casting devices potentially getting magic/missle/melee defense modifiers. I think there should be wield requirements based on perhaps level of focus/self total or something so you could scale the modifiers based on player level.

Cantrip on casting devices is a nice direction too I think.

brucehreese

03-21-2004, 03:36 PM

A scroll like the recall scrolls, or a gem that can be made or found on monsters that work like the lifestones do when you are portaled there after death. In other words when activated it will protect you for a time from harm unless you make an aggressive move. This would be usefull when in situations where you need to regroup for a minute to buff a weapon or yourself, or to get out of danger, or run thru a mob unbuffed. Let it only work for PvM , so as not to upset the PvP ballances. Let the timer be longer the lower the level player using it. It would be good to use when trying to recover a body that is surrounded by monsters, and no friends are around to help.

Genji-Glove

03-23-2004, 07:42 PM

^ no need to make the game too easy, why would they give players the ability to be invinsible when they are nearly there already...

Pellinore

03-24-2004, 10:47 AM

Brilliant.

When I click PLAY AC I would like to see a few things:

You are signed in as <Player Name> with account 1 of 3.

World Names with symbols (like the AC2 Symbols)
World founding date.
World Population.

Once you select your World:

Giant Play AC Link.
Live chat room.
Official World Discussion Forum Link.
Any updates or messages we need.
Screen Shot Gallery.
Player Listing.
Allegiance Listing - with website addresses.

Pellinore

03-24-2004, 10:57 AM

The day this is implimented will be a great day for AC. The sooner the better.

Lloth

03-24-2004, 03:53 PM

I participate in PKL about once every few weeks, and even then just to mess around with my buddys. I notice alot the revisions to this or that is typically to balance PK issues. What about the PvM players? To us "Carebears" PK's are just trash talkers and punks in general. Yet you continue to nerf the life magics of all players, taking away the effectiveness of the 12 credit cost to spec. the life magic skill. I like the thought that not every monster out there is capable to be war'd to death. I noticed the boss golem in the bottom of the fathomless chasm took next to no dmg from my war spells, but I could get about 90ish dmg with a hectacomb. I'm hoping that in mentioning this you guys dont decide to nerf the hectacomb spells lol.

I think that not being able to drain more health than you can use to heal yourself is a wonderful idea. I am pouting about my stam to health 1 spell going away though. Still, I totally understand that this is a lvl1 spell and as such should not be quite so powerful as it was.

War magic IS powerful. I whip out my FR wand and shoot a lvl120 acendant drudge and it dies 1 shot. Of course it took me 16 credits to specialize war, so why shouldn't it be powerful? Takes a long wind up to throw the spell, and with the increasing magic d of critters, if you get resisted your stuck winding up again.

Guess what I'm suggesting is more consideration of the PvM players out there that are getting tired of having our abilities nerfed because someone playing PK doesn't like it. I know next to nothing about PK other than I see a good number of them begging for this or that so that they can continue to play grab ass lol. There's already two sets of rules, one for PK's and one for non-PKs. Please don't nerf my mage again PLEASE. I have no interest in playing a melee or archer, I've always been a fan of mages but they are becoming the weaker class that spends twice as much skill creds. My mage crits for 600-700 dmg on VoD style creatures while the life archers are hitting constantly for OVER 1000 dmg and thats NOT a critical hit lol.

I love the ideas of self buffs taking much less time to cast as buffing is highly frustrating to me. The content demands that you buff, and for my 149 mage, a full set of buffs takes a little over 6 min to complete. Play 5 or 6 buffs a day and the time you've wasted waiting for the buffing cycle to complete has stacked up to a incredible amount of time. Thats assuming you don't die and have to rebuff lol. Less time spent self buffing would also reduce the headaches generated by those who don't understand that when questing... SYNC BUFFS! Fellow spells are long overdue I'd think, and are also a wonderful idea.

All in all I'm excited about the future of AC except maybe the removal of housing portals. Also a little depressed that the singularity keys I've been saving to buy those rare pack dolls have been reduced to practically worthless =( I sold a major war helm for 80 sings just a few weeks before the loot nerfs... LOL what rotten timing on my part.