Threat Blips Proposal

[Ibn]

After reading all of your feedback, I considered my goals and limitations. I believe the following proposal keeps the goal of using shape distinction between threats and non-threats, but eliminates the November problems of counting threats and determining which threats are allegiance members.

In this proposal, allegiance blips would return to squares -- there would be no more allegiance threat blips. Non-allegiance threat blips are still Xs, but they are 3x3 Xs, much easier to count and distinguish.

For comparison, first look at a November radar example (http://ac.turbinegames.com/files/17/26/32/93/66.bmp). How many PKs are there, and who is in your allegiance?

Now look at the proposed radar (http://ac.turbinegames.com/files/04/15/67/58/67.bmp). (Be sure you've got your screen set to the same resolution that you use when playing AC.)

Let me know what you think.

[Idhitit]

I think the new radar idea is much clearer allows for greater ease in distinguishing between allegience members and other players...

[Ivanhoe]

of course this is a great idea.

A even BETTER idea would be to increase the size of the radar onscreen so you can actually SEE the blips in resolutions that are higher then 800x600


Example:

http://www.oyouno.com/newradar.jpg

The current radar in higher res it is pretty much impossible to see ANYTHING at all

[Som|Blood]

Much better.

I haven't logged in today...those make it in this patch?

[Trai]

The new radar x symbols are too tiny. I have decent vision but it's very hard to distinguish which of the closer dots are X's and which are not. (Are they all x's in the cluster on the left?) It's going to give people with eye problems screaming headaches.

Stay away from the X idea, X's are too prone to cross-hatching one another. While cross hatching is a great blending technique it is a horrible way of allowing someone to distinguish individual blips.

Rightside and upside down triangles are better, imo.

[Ibn]

Originally posted by Som|Blood
I haven't logged in today...those make it in this patch?


No, this is a proposal for January.

[Ivanhoe]

can we get a bigger onscreen radar that works in higher resolutions?

The tiny blips are impossible to see.

[Trai]

If another player is in the same PK state and different allegaince as you, make the dot round. If another player is in a different PK state and different allegiance as you, make the dot some shape other than round or square.

Or use my earlier suggestion:
White round = npk player not in same allegiance or fellow
White square = npk player in the same allegiance but not in fellow

Red round = pk player not in same allegiance or fellow (a threat)
Red square = pk player in same allegiance but not in fellow

Pink round = pkl player not in same allegiance or fellow (a threat)
Pink square = pkl player in same allegiance but not in fellow

Green round = same pk status, not in same allegiance but in same fellow
Green Square = same pk status, in same allegiance and in same fellow
Green Upright Triangle = differing pk status, in same allegiance and fellow
Green Downward Triangle = differing pk status and allegiance, in same fellow

Using that system while fellowed...
Someone who plays as npk normally would be used to seeing Green rounds and squares in fellows.
Someone who plays on DT and hasn't been killed recently would be used to seeing green rounds and squares.
Someone who plays on DT but has been killed recently would see green triangles.
Someone who plays on an NPK server as a PK/L would normally see Green Triangles.





Making someone who IS a threat to you harder to distinguish is a bad idea. =/

Use X's for fishing holes if you insist on using them for something. That change wouldn't get anyone killed.

[Virindi Clown]

It needs different colors. No matter what you do you cannot distinguish between tiny shapes of the exact same color swarming a small area.

They MUST be different colors. It does not matter AT ALL what shapes the different things mean but the COLORS must differ.

[Ivanhoe]

they are messing with shapes for the people who are color blind.
But even still with 10+ people on screen its hard to tell whats what anyways

[Extinction]

That will be an improvement, but still sucky compared to the old one..

How about you change red dots back to the old style? We don't have any problems with that..

[Som|Blood]

Agreed old style would be best, but I could pk in big fights with this proposal.

[vizigoth]

Much improved, simply because it reverts allegiance members back to squares.

[kryptik]

Wewt, thnaks Ibn :)

[EshuunDara]

now if we only had hotkeys that would cycle through guildmates, and another set to cycle through non-guild mates...

[sylphia]

The problem is that you cant use colors as the sole defining difference. Many of our players are color blind and cant tell the difference between a green and red dot. But they can still recognize shapes, so the threat and non-threat blips really need to have fundamentally different shapes.

I hve sen a good suggestion that WILL help some here, Ibn: a larger radar. Make a clickable option in the character panels to increase the size of the radar itself up to 2-4 times its current size. When the side panels (inventory, spells, etc) is closed, there is plenty of room to view it without really hurting the UI display. When the panels are open it would be god-awful crowding though LOL. That would give folks who still have a hard time destinguishing the various blips another option to improve the visibility.

[kgober]

color-blindness need not stop anyone from using colored blips. it just limits your selection of colors a bit.

use a bluish-green, rather than a pure green, like they do on traffic lights. blue-green *can* be differentiated from red by color-blind people (or so I'm told).

-ken

[scorcher]

Making radar option bigger is a good idea, you could even have an option to select the amount of transparency in the radar so you could see behind it, also while shapes are good, let the ones who can see colors take advantage of their sight and make blips different colors. Even further allow monarchs to update a database of friends, foes, and unkowns, and select colors for each.

I will use minipk as an example, this is something I was thinking of the other day and im sure I am not the first. If we are in a huge fight and we have allies and foes on the same radar it is very hard to distinguish nonallegiance allies from targets. It would be nice to have all of our allies, enemies, unknowns, and allegiance members whatever color we specify. Put all of this in a menu that only the monarch can have access to and perhaps the monarch can even add a user or two to his list that can also keep the database updated. Then we could choose the color of our allegiance members, allies, enemies, and unknown targets. This would allow us to distinguish very easily who and where our enemies, friends, and unknowns are instead of just being able to see guild members then other targets, which in a blown out group fight is hard to tell who is friend or foe. You could even make a menu for color blind options to set the shapes of the blips so anyone who is color blind can change their shapes to what is best for them.

While the shapes idea is an improvement for color blind people, at the same time it is hindering the ones who can see color. Color distinguishment added to all these shapes, is obviously superb for those who can see color. Adding the options described above to set colors would truly be the best way to distinguish radar blips for those who can see color.

I know this would be hard to implement , but minipk does all this as a plugin, altho it does not have the power to change the blips, it certainly makes it seem very doable. It would be nice to see ac implement this sometime in the future.

Allowing allegiance monarchs to set their own shapes and colors for friends, foes, unknowns, and allegiance members sets the way for true diversity in radar technology( haha had to say it :D )

[Yinchi]

I am not PK but I would like to see the old squares back for fellows with the leader a different shape as we had.

Will the new changes do this?

[Ardham]

Would be nice if allegiance were a different color than the rest of the dots... not a box, or a dot difference.

In a Fellow having an allegiance member be more "vivid" green than the rest of the fellow may also be a good thing, would be nice to know who in the green dots is clan or not quickly.

[Ivanhoe]

If you play in higher then 800x600 res the radar is to smal to make out much n the screen .
Add 10+ people on your radar and it really is impossible to make out anything.

Making the radar size Bigger in higher res mode is the first step imo
Then and only then will these minor triangle,squares etc changes make any differnce at all.

[Tanoshi]

Trai stated that cross hatching might be a problem with X's --- wouldn't a + (plus) solve that problem??

[Ivanhoe]

Another idea here is to make US the player able to change colors of certain people By there alliance or status (friendly,war,ally)

Having different colors for the above would be great for pvp fights which right now is a big clusterbuck on the radar screen.

Different colors For guild wars. (ally,friendly,war)

Bigger Radar on screen so we can actually SEE it in higher res modes

[Whisp'r]

My godess you people could complicate making ice cubes.

Run 'er up the flagpole Ibn, see if she wiggles. (Means give it a try!). If we absolutely hate it, dont worry, I'm sure someone will thoughtfully and caringly express their feeelings on this here forum...LOL

[Emeritus]

I like the idea of keeping the X's the same size as they were, but keeping Allegiance members the squares w/o X's through them

[Sizlunt DT]

Well, it beats the hell out of the giant red x's. The way the radar is now, almost anything would be an improvement.