What Ruined Darktide.

[Dark_Razer]

This is all IMHO.

Housing / town nerfing: - Apartments, Cottages, Villas and Mansions. They took people away from towns. They meant there was no point to controlling towns. And town fighting was great, it was something to fight over, something to defend. Added to this the nerfage of the 'uber' towns, meant that towns lost there value even more.

Chains / Macros: - Chains weren’t so bad, in some ways the encouraged fighting, to control good levelling places. But, still, chains got people to level 126, macros pushed people past it. Chains weren’t near as bad without macros, macros made chains uber. Before macroing, a lvl 120 was HIGH! Lvl 80 was good, lvl 50-60's could still compete. Now, most of the main pvpers are lvl 150-200. And that’s all well and nice, but the ONLY WAY for a new person to get to that level is via macroing (something that’s illegal). And even then, macroing burns you out.

What happened to the "good old days" where you fought to control BSD or that ML tusker dun (with the hollow minions in the back). What happened to raiding AB for bloods, or swarto for antis. And then antis' coming to fight you! What happened to all the n00bs on at the starter towns.

Class balance didn't ruin darktide. Housing and macroing ruined darktide. You used to beable to run from town to town looking for a fight, and actually SEE people running around darktide. Now, pfft. Sure, there’s still people around, but they are all lvl 126+. And that’s fine, but it ruins the middle game.
As much as being lvl 200 is cool, stop thinking about yourself and start thinking about the game as a whole. Characters are meant to have strong points and week points, not be uber at everything. Its like allowing cheats in a game of counter strike, giving everyone full armour and all the weapons. They game just becomes no more fun. Sure, you get kills, but its just not as fun, not as competitive.


Anyway, that’s IMHO. Darktide was at its best before housing, before macroing, where PEOPLE mattered. Where being lvl 30 ment that you where a n00b, not a nonfactor. Back then we had something to fight for. Back then, we had more people on our server.

People didn't leave darktide because it got old, the left because it got boring.

All this quest BS, wheepings, lurable breastplates etc. Its all nice etc, and it might unbalance the classes, but we've lived though that before. The balance was always changing. But losing towns, and macro's, have ruined darktide.

That’s my humble opinion, someone who played AC and DT starting of march 2000. I killed Fu-Dun-Chi (if any of you know who he is) at lvl 15 (When he was 13). Darktide has evolved, but its gone too far, its become TOO easy.

[Care Police]

Besides the fact that the people overseeing DT are incompetent and rode the short yellow bus to school, I agree with you.:(

[Dark_Razer]

I don't know if it was so much about incompitant dev's or more about them giving the players what the players thought they wanted. Housing is all very well and good on white servers, but on darktide it just ruines it.

IMO, levels on white servers again, don't really mean much, player A can't really effect player B's game play. However, on darktide, your level is a HUGE part of your playing experiance. It affects everything, from being able to go shoping, to defending your vassels when they are trying to level.

Maybe instead of the dev's going "well, this is what the player base and other games want/doing" they should have gone "well, what is the affect of this, is it really going to advance the game? or, is it going to ruin a part of the current gameplay?"



Hrm, interesting never the less. I for one can't wait till the server emulation software advances to a largescale usable state. I doub that turbine would introduce a server that was rolled back to the "golden times" of DT (hell, even a new red server would be a MASIVE step in the right direction), but a player run server (Simmilar to IPY, i hate UO btw) would be 'uber'.

I'd be preparied to donate to purchessing hardware and running costs of something like that. I could imagin you'd have a LOT of old DT'ers coming back.

[Care Police]

The devs should just hire some DT beta testers or give out their ideas a longer time before they actually implement them into the game. The new communication plan was the right step to take, but, it could be even better. And I think putting out a new server is a good idea, I just think it should have been a new red server because WE is currently newest server, and is white, so, it should be red's turn.:)

[Kilmor]

Sorry, there is no simple solution and removing houses certainly ain't. In the old days you ran for a while into the wilderness to buff or mule, but since Decal was introduced, this is no longer an option.
So, for muling and buffing some other margin of safety is required to replace the "security by bloody big landscape".
If there were no 3rd party utils, I could live without safe housing.

[Dark_Razer]

thats exactly the problem tho Kilmor, everyone wants there luxarys, houses, macros, etc. but thats whats ruined darktide. Ya, you risk losing stuff, but an element of risk is fun!

Stop makeing it so easy for us. Make us EARN our place on darktide, its not a right. It used to be if you wanted to live on DT, you'd have to try and survive, level by yourself, untill you find friends. Now, you can log in and see no one around the newbie lifestone =/

[Kilmor]

It's not risk, if I know that some Decal plug will reveal me, if a certainity. Remove detection plug-ins along with the houses and I am fine.

[Virindi Clown]

Housing barriers + more and more no-drop stuff + macros = every problem there is right now one way or the other.

[Dark_Razer]

Na, No drop stuff is fine IMO. We where fine in the GSA + atlan + focusing stone days.

As for your muleing Kilmor, if you can't find a spot where you won't be "caught with your pants down" as it where, then your seriously not trying mate.

Tie to some remote wilderness if you need to. Remember, with houseing gone, the majority of DTers are going to be in towns, dun's, and points of interest, not spread all over the landscape at settelements.

[Rojon]

What ruined Darktide was the cheats, hacks, and general 8 year old behaviour of the majority that played there.

Drove good people right off the server.

Everything else came after...

[Lutieus]

Darktide has a great many wonderful people. If you're not finding any, you're simply not looking in the right places.

[DemonicTut0r]

i agree 100% and i think the stone age of DT was the best...when a lv 100 was unheard of and controlling things was in the game...housing is a load of junk, we need our own updates different from the white seversJH.

IBN listen to our call....otherwise you WILL lose ALL your DT players!

[Rojon]

Originally posted by Lutieus
Darktide has a great many wonderful people. If you're not finding any, you're simply not looking in the right places.
We looked far and wide.

After two years we quit looking. The vast overwhelming majority was what I said it was, and from the boards it still is, only worse.

Darktiders have no one to blame but themselves for the current state of the server.

[Dark_Razer]

Rojon, ALL servers used thoes hacks and cheats. Hacks and cheats (unless you include macroing in cheating) didn't ruin darktide. They only changed the ballance of classes (which was (and still is)) constantly changing anyway.

People will ALWAYS look for the edge, its human nature. I don't blame people for being themselves, I don't even blame turbine for not stoping it, thats almost imposable (theres maybe 20 devs? and how many people looking for that edge? 2000?). Cheats, Hacks did NOT RUIN DARKTIDE. Darktideiens did have a part to play in their downfall, they made the choice to macro. But even that, once somone started, everyone had to do it to keep up.


Lutieus, your right, Darktide does have a great many wonderfull people. But it used to have more. It used to have people running around in town, raiding other towns, defending leveling spots, ACTUALY LEVELING!


I've been thinking about this for a couple of days, and here's what I've come up with as some posable solutions to the state of darktide :-

Houseing : - Remove house barriers, all of em. People arn't going to accept loesing their houses. But haveing no safe place to hide would go a long way to restoring the old DT. You'd have older DT players back by the 100's, so who cairs about loseing a few that can't hack it. If you want safe, go to white servers.

Macroing/Chaining : - seriously Turbine, you guys do try, but good luck trying to stop people macroing. 90% of thoes over 126 have macroed, or have been pushed by a chain with macroers in it. Put an exp cap in at lvl 126. People arn't going to bother macroing near as much, and quite frankly, I have no problems with people macroing to 126 (stuff leveling a couple of charcters to that by hand).
This would also go a LONG way to balancing the classes. I have no idea how you actualy ballance classes when each class changes in power differently thoughout the levels. So, pick a max level (126 would be great IMHO) and ballance the classes there.

A server wipe/New RED server : - Its too late for darktide. And a server wipe isn't an option realisticly. Start a new Red server. I can garantee that your going to get a lot of old DTer's back, and white people back. Think about all thoes white players who have gotten to the end game and gone "well...um, this is fun =/, i've gotten everything" and then quit. They can't compete on the current darktide (i pitty any n00b trying), theres no way to catch up to lvl 200 people when the chains are gone, and your trying to stop everyone macroing.
Start from scratch, learn from your mistakes, people will come back. I can list 5 off the top of my head that would, + another 20 that would posably want to try it, now that they have a chance.

Makers of MMORPG's have seen how MASSIVELY popular IPY (For thoes that don't know, a pre-R UO free shard) is. Look at why it is. People want what it used to be like, they enjoyed the old game. They want what they had, they want a challange, but they also want a chance. They want people to kill, things to fight over, and to be challanged.


P.S. I'm sorry about my spelling, I don't have Word on this computer. However, look past that, you can still glean the meaning I'm sure.

[Rojon]

Originally posted by Dark_Razer
Rojon, ALL servers used thoes hacks and cheats. Hacks and cheats (unless you include macroing in cheating) didn't ruin darktide. They only changed the ballance of classes (which was (and still is)) constantly changing anyway.
I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on that.

Everyone in my allegiance eventually quit because of the reasons I stated. MS/Turbine showed no ability or interest in fixing the things we objected to, and as a strict honor guild we would never stoop to using cheats just to be competitive.

Coupled with the constant vulgarity and verbal abuse that would make a sailor blush, most of them just quit AC entirely, whereas I moved back to playing HG full-time.

I appreciate your opinion, but for all the people in our guild, I have to say we'd disagree.

[Lutieus]

If you base your current perception of DT on VN, then yeah, you'll have a very low opinion of it. Those boards have always attracted the dregs of society, from every server. It's just exaggerated on VN-DT because ingame rivalries spill over onto the forums. Nicer folks tend to stick to clan message boards.

I'm curious what places ingame you frequented, because I meet helpful, friendly people all over the place. I'd also wonder what clan you were in. As you probably know, the tag you wear can make a HUGE difference with how people comport themselves toward you, especially if other people sharing your tag have given it a bad name.

Anyway, sucks that you didn't meet any nice people. But there really are quite a few of them, trust me.

[Virindi Clown]

There are lots of cool antis. I'm sure there are some really stupid and irritating ones, but all the ones that I really know are cool people.

I haven't run into a lot of cool PKs lately, or in a long time really.

I think that is one of the bad points of the state of DT now. There used to be groups of PKs people hated, and groups of guys who were cool but just fought everyone. Things have shifted in strange directions.

DT used to have a lot of unity, and I'd say macros and housing messed that up. Nothing to fight for.

No-drop shadow armor and atlans were no big deal, because items you could loot could outdo them in power, but you could lose them. You had to work for the items to make the stuff back then, or to get good loot. It was a trade off that made sense.

Now we have shadow armor that rivals tinkered armor because of its average pros and wards that can even reduce war damage, weeping weapons, and the aegis, ALL of which are no-drop and either 100% required for PvP or are one of the main factors of it.

I thought it went too far to have kith helms, and now we have knorr helms of several kinds and walking boots. It's pretty sick.

[L0st]

I agree with u DR, except for one thing. NO MACROING, EVER. Not even to get to level 126, macroing is evil. But on everything else, particularly the safe zones on Darktide with housing...get rid of it! Thats my 2 cents worth anyway.

[Xetkec]

I also agree with Dark Razer. Old Darktide was so much more fun. When there was so many more poeple and there wasnt like hundreds of lvl 126+'s running round. Macroing and chains and houseing and **** like that screwed up the game. Bring back old Darktide.